Total Elected Delegates
Bonoff - 48
Madia - 84.5
Uncommitted - 7
Total Superdelegates
Bonoff - 15
Madia - 2
Uncomitted - 2
Total Delegates
Bonoff - 63
Madia- 86.5
Uncommitted - 9
95 delegates are required to win the DFL endorsement. That means Madia can win the endorsement without getting a single Bonoff defector if he sweeps the uncommitteds. Also, many of the superdelegates endorsed Bonoff when she was the prohibitive front runner. It would not be surprising for some of them to change their vote or, more likely, don’t show up to the convention. Bonoff’s best strategy at this point may be to attempt to block the endorsement and shoot for the primary. That would be difficult to do - conventions want to endorse a candidate.
Here in the Eighth District, Jim Oberstar brings home the bacon and fries it up in the pan. But oh, it would be great to have a district representative who EXCITES voters. Go Madia!
Does anyone have a list of all the superdelegates and who they’re endorsing? I don’t think I’ve seen their names anywhere.
Ashwin Madia was GREAT at SD41!
It was a wonderful dayand I can’t wait to vote for his endorsement at the 3rd congressional convention!
Any news on how Franken is doing today. Is he becoming a lock against JNP?? Zack or Sean a post on that race would be helpful.
Wow! I should never underestimate the ability of a bunch of my fellow democrats to pick the candidate least likely to win in November…
You all are tragic. Bonoff was the one candidate who could win in November. She was the clear and easy choice in this race. She is a talented, young, articulate DFL candidate in a tough district. She is the only candidate to enter this race who has won as a DFLer in the heart the GOP land that we call CD 3.
Shame on this blog and the commenters for rooting for an untested former republican. (And an anti-labor one at that: http://www.mndaily.com/articles/1996/11/04/1935.).
When we lose in the third, I’ll know who to blame…
P.S.
Will someone tell the Madia campaign that they can’t use campaign T-shirts made in Honduras. I looked at the t-shirts they are giving away, and they were made in Honduras. If it was a mistake, they need to throw those things away and start over. If they keep using them, I’m going to assume it was intentional.
Grow up.
Impressive indeed for Madia. Nobody heard of this guys only a few short months “or was it weeks” ago and now he is the front runner for the nod.
It shows what a great candidate, great staff, and more importantly great volunteer he has in the third. A team I would love to see expanded and run the table in the fall.
I see this thing going second or third ballot tops, no primary. Bonoff has a good spot in the senate and will probably remain there. She has need to burn bridges within the party.
Wow.. classy NorthbyNWDFL (or WFM). Instead of congratulate a candidate who ran a great campaign and support him against the GOP you decide to try (again) to trash him. Classy.
“Grow up”?
Nice response. Does “grow up” mean that I should look aside when I see a candidate ruining my party? How about a response to my points. In case you missed them, I’ll number them:
1) Madia can’t beat Paulson.
2) Bonoff can beat Paulson. Look at her victory in 2005…
3) Terri Bonoff is an amazing candidate. Take a look at Walter Mondale’s endorsement of her on her endorsements page: http://www.terribonoff.com/endorsements
4) Ash Madia used to be a republican and hasn’t explained his conversion. Does he still believe that the teacher’s union is what’s holding back education (http://www.mndaily.com/articles/1996/11/04/1935.)? Does he still believe that the U of M faculty shouldn’t be allowed to unionize (http://www.mndaily.com/articles/1997/01/31/3191)? Does he still support presidential candidates like Bob Dole and John McCain who want to curtail Medicare and Social Security (see the teachers union link)? How about some answers to these questions?
5) Madia wants to keep a ton of troops in Iraq, but keeps talking like he’s the one who will pull them out.
6) Yes, it should bother all of you that his T-Shirts are made in Honduras and printed in a non-union shop. In the recent history of our party I can’t think of one candidate who had the gall to do that. We need to hold our campaigns accountable for their behavior. This is a big deal.
I hope you have real reposts and not just more snark…
“1) Madia can’t beat Paulson.”
If you look at the poll commissioned by the Bonoff campaign, he is only down 3 to Paulsen, and I’m sure he has the lowest name rec of any of the three candidates. It sure looks like he can win to me.
“2) Bonoff can beat Paulson. Look at her victory in 2005…”
I don’t disagree with this.
“3) Terri Bonoff is an amazing candidate. Take a look at Walter Mondale’s endorsement of her on her endorsements page: http://www.terribonoff.com/endorsements”
Terri is a qualified candidate, but she has shown little ability to excite voters.
“4) Ash Madia used to be a republican and hasn’t explained his conversion. Does he still believe that the teacher’s union is what’s holding back education (http://www.mndaily.com/articles/1996/11/04/1935.)? Does he still believe that the U of M faculty shouldn’t be allowed to unionize (http://www.mndaily.com/articles/1997/01/31/3191)? Does he still support presidential candidates like Bob Dole and John McCain who want to curtail Medicare and Social Security (see the teachers union link)? How about some answers to these questions?”
He has addressed this many times. Lots of Democrats used to be Republicans. Hillary Clinton was president of the Wellesley Young Republicans.
“5) Madia wants to keep a ton of troops in Iraq, but keeps talking like he’s the one who will pull them out.”
While I support a full withdrawal from Iraq, I don’t believe Bonoff has taken a particularly progressive stance on it either.
“6) Yes, it should bother all of you that his T-Shirts are made in Honduras and printed in a non-union shop. In the recent history of our party I can’t think of one candidate who had the gall to do that. We need to hold our campaigns accountable for their behavior. This is a big deal.”
I’m pretty sure it was checked out that they were union. There was a large dust up about it on a earlier post and I believe the campaign was contacted and verified that they were union.
The T-Shirt stuff was an error the campaign has said and has been remedied.
Campaign t-shirts were ordered from 7 Corners, a union shop.
Sen. Bonoff was elected 2 times with massive DFL help from outside the district, which impacted local races in neighboring senate districts. But, we did it.
People on the southern side of the district have, perhaps, had more interaction with Erik Paulsen. Bonoff-Paulsen allows apples to apples comparisons … 2-1/2 years legislative experience to 12 years.
“1) Madia can’t beat Paulson.”
He beat Bonoff. And, Bonoff’s own poll shows he can beat Paulsen.
“2) Bonoff can beat Paulson. Look at her victory in 2005…”
Madia can beat Bonoff, see his last 10 victories over her.
“3) Terri Bonoff is an amazing candidate. Take a look at Walter Mondale’s endorsement of her on her endorsements page: http://www.terribonoff.com/endorsements”
Made before Ash had any recognition.
“4) Ash Madia used to be a republican and hasn’t explained his conversion. Does he still believe that the teacher’s union is what’s holding back education (http://www.mndaily.com/articles/1996/11/04/1935.)? Does he still believe that the U of M faculty shouldn’t be allowed to unionize (http://www.mndaily.com/articles/1997/01/31/3191)? Does he still support presidential candidates like Bob Dole and John McCain who want to curtail Medicare and Social Security (see the teachers union link)? How about some answers to these questions?”
He has explained his conversion. Iraq, law school, his work, and his experiences related to LGBT issues being just a few.
“5) Madia wants to keep a ton of troops in Iraq, but keeps talking like he’s the one who will pull them out.”
He’s never claimed to be the get out of war iraq candidate. Indeed, he specifically has gone after the other candidates on this very issue.
“6) Yes, it should bother all of you that his T-Shirts are made in Honduras and printed in a non-union shop. In the recent history of our party I can’t think of one candidate who had the gall to do that. We need to hold our campaigns accountable for their behavior. This is a big deal.”
His T-Shirts were printed in a union shop.
So, is there any doubt now that Bonoff drops? Any passionate Bonoff supporter here who says she is going to take this to the convention? Or does she see the writing on the wall, and drop?
Marc? Wellstone in the Heart Foreover — you said Ash would never get the endorsement. Do you want to eat those words now?
This thing is over. My prediction Bonoff drops tomorrow.
Response to NorthbyNWDFL:
I completely agree that Terri Bonoff is a talented, young, articulate DFL candidate.
As for Ashwin being an anti-labor former Republican, Ashwin readily admits to having been a Republican before he served in the Marine Corps, and before the George W. era. But I have only heard Ashwin say positive things about labor unions and their contributions to our country.
So I read the story from the link. It was dated 1996. Ashwin was 18 years old. The article was somewhat simplistic, but also engaged, patriotic and idealistic. Certainly an interesting start for someone whose political views have evolved a lot.
Maybe instead of bashing Madia and his supporters, we could all come together and share our wisdom and experience to help him win in November.
After the last Senate District Convention in CD3, Terri has two choices:
1)Fight tooth and nail in a long shot attempt to prevent an endorsement at the CD3 Convention. If she succeeds, it will clearly show that there has been no substance to her claims to support the Democratic agenda. All along it has really all been about her personal ambition. I am a Terri Bonoff fan. I would be disillusioned to say the least if this is the path she takes. I would focus the majority of my time and treasure to making sure someone this cynical lost any primary contest held now or in any future election. I really don’t want to believe Terri will do this.
2)Find the most gracious way possible to bring the party together between now and when the CD3 Convention concludes. She has to honor the really admirable efforts of her supporters and take the high ground. Terri is a young woman. She has a bright future if she can maneuver this challenge effectively. She could leave this particular contest with a very high profile and a sterling reputation among the Democrats in Minnesota.
I really hope she does not get caught up in the ego trip of the horse race and she can step back and make the right choice.
Look at what Walter Mondale’s endorsment did for Hillary Clinton in Minnesota.
The parallels between this race and the presidential race are remarkable. Establishment woman as the early front runner, has all the St. Paul/D.C support right out the gate. Then an exciting young non-white man with a strong life story, and life experiences shakes things up. Removes the inevitable banner from her, and shortly after she goes negative and begins loosing contests.
Let’s have a little faith in the elected delegates at the congressional district level. They are the ones that are going to be doing the phone banking and door knocking. Not Walter Mondale. Not the superdelagates.
Media can win. Bonoff can win. Let the delageates choose who they want to work for in the fall.
I agree with you Redsson! Anyone have a different view -that Terri could continue…
Well, thanks for the real response… Ahem björnkram…
Anyway, my counters on the same points:
1) Bonoff does significantly better in that poll against Paulson than Madia does. There’s no reason to think that the DFL candidate will start doing better after Paulson starts attacking them.
2) This is a historic opportunity to take this seat. This means real things to the people of this country. Taking this seat means another vote for health care; another vote for education; another vote for economic growth; another vote to end the war in Iraq. I’m glad you agree that she can beat Paulson. What I don’t understand is why a lot of dems don’t seem to care. Winning is the key. We’re playing with peoples educational opportunities, with their health care, with their lives. I can not for the life of me see why we’re not picking the person who can win.
3) I wish voters were more excited about Terri, but voter excitement isn’t what we need especially in this district in the fall. The district has one of the highest voter turnouts in the nation. ALL of the Democrats will vote in CD3 regardless of who our candidate is (also, keep in mind that Obama will probably be at the top of the ticket). What we need is a DFL candidate who pulls the middle. That’s what it takes to win in CD3.
4) I’ll grant you that a conversion to DFL politics is a good thing. I’d love it if you would give me a link to something to read. I haven’t seen much evidence of his real heartfelt conversion. I’m not necissarily doubting you. But with issues like this I’d want to see some evidence and haven’t found any.
5) Start with the websites:
http://www.terribonoff.com/issues/iraq
http://www.madiaforcongress.com/issues.htm
There’s a difference. And if you find Terri’s position vague, remember that she has to win in a GOP district. Sometimes its better for the DFL agenda for a candidate not to be too specific.
6) ok, so I couldn’t find a union “bug” on the t-shirt I saw. Union shops put their union logo or “bug” on their stuff. If you don’t know what I’m talking about do a google image search for “union bug”. Also, I’ve yet to find a union shop that prints on foreign t-shirts. And again if you know something I don’t about this, give me a link.
Ok, so there you have it. My point and counter point. I’m just really sad today, and I’m disappointed in my party. And I wish this blog had bothered to give Terri a fair shake. You never wanted to and I’ll remember that when Paulson is in congress.
In response to NorthbyNWDFL’s:
“P.S. Will someone tell the Madia campaign that they can’t use campaign T-shirts made in Honduras. I looked at the t-shirts they are giving away, and they were made in Honduras. If it was a mistake, they need to throw those things away and start over. If they keep using them, I’m going to assume it was intentional.”
First off, that’s just wrong. I have 3 of these shirts in my home and there is NOTHING on them indicating that they are made in Honduras, so your claim is bunk.
Second, I’ve had about enough of this t-shirt sniping. The Madia campaign’s shirts are from a union shop and they have obviously made earnest efforts to honor unions in their campaign materials. In a globalized world, however, I’m sure very few individuals, much less campaigns, can have every single item associated with them from a pro-union, Made-in-the-U.S.A. shop. I don’t doubt that Bonoff’s campaign has served donuts or other such things out of Made-in-China plastic containers, ordered bottles of water with caps made in Mexico, etc. I’m sure the candidates wear Italian shoes from time to time as well. It’s inescapable given NAFTA and other similar trade agreements; it’s simply the state of our global economy. ALL we can do, barring changes to this economic / trade regime, is make our best, most earnest efforts.
The point is that the campaign has made earnest efforts in ordering from a union shop, and if ever there were a Honduran shirt out of that campaign, the issue was recognized and rectified, but it is 100% false that the current shirts are from Honduras, so you need to stop leveraging false claims in an effort to smear Madia.
Finally, let’s try to NOT model the national campaign’s sniping and instead focus on the real issues.
Madia has taken a strong stance on making free trade fair trade and an even stronger stance AGAINST outsourcing. He has committed to protecting our economy much more firmly than Bonoff (I’m referencing the debates as well as their public statements), so in the face of globalization, he really ought to be your candidate if stuff like this bothers you deeply!
Trolling doesn’t warrant a “real response”.
NorthbyNWDFL
So you acknowledge that Bonoff will not fight, and will concede this thing.
It’s not really trolling if you’re a DFLer and a regular reader and occasional poster on this blog, does it?
Anyone who looks at my posts with an open eye will see a sad and disgusted democrat who wishes his party would stand up and fight with candidates who can win.
trolling… thats a new one.
Lets Get Real: I have no idea, but I hope she doesn’t. March is more than a little early for demanding “for the good of the party” decisions. The convention is in APRIL. I don’t hear a drum beat on here for JNP to drop out before the state convention in June… This is so much earlier that other states decide their races. And no one outside of the DFL will be listening for months to come. For the good of your family and mine, I hope she stays in and I hope she wins.
OKAY–ENOUGH ABOUT THE SHIRTS! THE MADIA SHIRTS WERE PURCHASED FROM SEVEN CORNERS PRINT SHOP, A UNION PRINT SHOP STAFFED WITH UNION WORKERS. CHECK IT OUT.
Ashwin Madia has run a flawless campain, stayed positive and deserves the endorsement.
Ash will easily win in Novmeber!
NorthbyNWDFL sounds like a very sore loser. Time to get in the fold and support our democratic candidate!
I have to say, I think this is GREAT! Ash is going to be a great candidate for the DFL in the 3rd. Senator Obama is going to have long coat-tails, and democrats are jazzed for a fight.
Of course, the presidential nomination could go otherwise, and then we will all be in deep trouble.
Whoa.
In what world did I become a Bonoff supporter? I don’t trust her at all. Her union support is not based on her record, but on her promise to be better in Congress.
I can’t stand her and think her to be so selfisb and opportunistic that she will stay in hoping for a fumble by Ash.
This may come as a shock to some but, the only union shop that has American made shirts is All American up in Wyoming, Mn. Call around real quick and verify for yourself.
NorthbyNWDFL
What is her path to victory at this point? How can she be anything other than a spoiler? I am just curious. I am not asking this to be argumentative. I respect your passion. I just wonder if you see any conceivable way she wins this endorsement, or forces this to a primary. I don’t with the lead Ash has.
Well, he needs to get 60% for an endorsement, and I’m pretty sure that he’s not quite there (anybody have a cumulative count that includes supers?). So though I’m disappointed and worried, I’m going to hold out hope that enough of the CD 3 delegates can be persuaded to her side. I know that I’m being hopeful, but despite what southwestdem says, we don’t have a “democratic candidate” yet. What we have is one candidate who holds more of the delegates to the endorsing convention and one who (in my opinion) would be a better choice. When you have family that are under-insured and friends who have no health insurance at all, you cling to the hope that your party will do the right thing.
So that’s where I’m coming from. I know that its an uphill battle for her. I know that I may very well be disappointed, but I hope that the DFL and this blog community will hold off for the next 3 weeks and allow her to campaign for the endorsement. And (to go back to southwestdem’s post, It’s not accurate to call me a sore loser, because this isn’t a game)
I look forward to a more detailed analysis. I know that the SD41 “uncommitted” delegate was for Jack Nelson-Pallmeyer and a candidate who would seriously address Single Payer Health Care, Climate Change, Peace, Education, Economic Justice.
If you were to read, NorthbyNWDFL instead of whining and getting your hopes all up, you have been at this link, you would have been able to figure out mathematically how Bonoff will lose.
http://mnpublius.com/2008/03/cd-3-results-2/
UPDATE 8 - According to our preliminary numbers, it is no longer mathematically possible for Bonoff to overtake Madia in elected delegates. In order to overtake him in total delegates, she must win 78% of the remaining delegates. Remember, however, that it takes 60% to win the endorsement. In order to secure a first ballot endorsement, Madia would need 91% of the outstanding delegates (thats if all uncommitted went to Bonoff.) Unless Bonoff were to win the support of some elected Madia delegates, it is no longer possible for Bonoff to win a first ballot endorsement.
UPDATE 9 - SD 40 numbers are preliminary (to be clear, I classify all numbers as preliminary until I can verify the count with both campaigns).
UPDATE 10 - Numbers out of 33 are preliminary. If these numbers hold up, Madia has secured a majority on the first ballot.
I have a Madia t from Feb. 5th and it was made in
El Salvador. I do think the issue is petty.
I’m much more interested in the war, the economy,
our abuse of civil rights - domestic and foreign,
global warming, and universal health care.
I think Bonoff thought this would be handed to her
and she coasted until it was too late. She’s also
what I call a Republican Lite, which might be good
in November, but not in a Democratic Primary.
I had never heard of Madia until he called me one
night and talked issues with me as long as I wanted.
My next experience with the campaign was learning
that Bonoff did not support ending the Bush Tax Cuts.
Ball game over for me.
I’m the one who called Paul Wellstone a conservative,
so none of them are liberal enough for me except maybe
Jack Nelson-Pallmeyer. But I like Madia’s no fear to
tell you where he stands approach. I think his charisma,
his appeal to American’s highest ideals, and being an Iraq
war vet will wear well in November.
Bonoff’s electability poll doesn’t bother me becuase certainly
two people now in St. Paul will have more name recognition than
Madia. But this guy came out of nowhere to put her out, so he
certainly has something going for him.
So, bottom line, on April 12 I’m voting for Madia and I’m expecting
that voter excitement to carry over to November. And I believe
the independents will come. And I hope NorthbyNWDFL will join
the party.
Not to jack this thread but does anybody know who won endorsment for 19B? Dennis Sucik or Chris Brazelton? Or how about some delagate number from Bob Olson and El Tink? I cant find anything on the web :-(
In order to win, Dems to need to think about who pulls the most independents in a General. The 3rd, by recent elections, still leans Red. My read of the numbers is that as late as 2006, which was a heavy Dem year, the bases were about 41% Republican and 35% Democrat. The Democratic candidate will need to pull over 62% of Independents to beat Paulsen.
Is that better done with a working mom to appeal to the females, or a minority veteran who will draw from the Vets and perhaps some minorities (who aren’t already committed to that Democratic 35%).
I don’t know the answer. Just putting it out there.
NorthbyNWDFL: “1) Bonoff does significantly better in that poll against Paulson than Madia does. There’s no reason to think that the DFL candidate will start doing better after Paulson starts attacking them.”
The poll shows a four-point difference between Madia and Bonoff. Paulson’s numbers range only three points. To the best of my knowledge, the Bonoff campaign has not released the margin of error for this poll, despite providing other information on the poll such as the number of respondents, dates on which the poll was conducted, how respondents were selected, and other data. Given what we do know — that the campaign chose to omit the MoE, and that the sample size is 401 — it’s hard to see how the MoE could be less than +/- 3%, which puts Madia and Paulsen in a statistical tie.
Making a claim eight months out from election day that Madia cannot win, on the basis of a poll with an undisclosed MoE and undisclosed demographic breakdown that shows both DFLers just four points apart in their matchups with the Republican candidate, is absolutely ridiculous.
I had figured that Madia can’t win the district, but Bonhoff’s poll convinced me that maybe he can.
Blogger:
What difference does it make who has the better chance. I personally think Madia does. But, it’s irrelevant. He has enough elected delegates to have this thing sewn up. Game over.
“What difference does it make who has the better chance.”
Umm, I dunno. I think it makes a big difference, actually.
‘“What difference does it make who has the better chance.â€
Umm, I dunno. I think it makes a big difference, actually.’
In regards to who gets the nomination, it doesn’t. What matters is who has the delegates. Now, obviously the selection of those delegates is probably at least partially based on electability. But from a mechanics standpoint what matters is delegates.
Thanks for the clarification, Archer. I agree. At this point, it doesn’t matter a whole lot. It looks like Madia has it unless Bonoff can work some magic between now and April.
What was taken as me trying to make a point was truly a question: In a general, where voters often make decisions on ads and the most brief of news coverage, who gets more voters: A woman, or a veteran who happens to be minority?
It doesn’t matter for April. It only matters for November. And I dare say November is more important than April.
Neither I nor probably most of the other 80 delegates
had ever heard of this guy until a couple of months ago.
Yet he has buried by nearly a 2-1 margin in elected delegates
the candidate who was being handed this nomination with about
a 20 delegates from St. Paul before the first vote was cast.
I think we can say two things about ‘08. First, there are no
incumbant nor incumbant coat tails. If anything, the incumbant
coat tails (War and Economy) should benefit us. Secondly, a
guy who can come out of nowhere to win so convincingly, probably
has the ability to overcome your demographics. There have to
be a few working mom’s in his numbers, because all the vets and
minorites won’t add up to 81.5 - 43 margin (Madia camp elected
delegate numbers).
Better chance does make a difference, but people didn’t vote for
Wellstone because they agreed with his positions, he had that
something Minnesotans like. I’m betting Madia does too.
dmc - Just for clarification, Wellstone never carried the 3rd CD or pulled more than 50% of the statewide vote, but I get your point. I’m sure there are some working moms in his numbers. I’d just love to get the breakout. Now that there will be more national money and brainpower at his disposal, I’m sure we’ll uncover those trends.
lets get real - One possible thought on Bonoff is that perhaps she thinks that she can get more of the moderate vote, and while only a fraction of the moderate vote makes it out for a SD convention, many times more would come for a primary.
Not saying I back that approach, just trying to give one possible theory since you were asking for ideas.
It’s interesting because the papers (star tribune) have this race at 81.5 to 63. Different than the this blog site. I wonder if they are not counting Madia’s superdelgates and how they get an extra delegate for Bonoff.
Also, the papers say Bonoff is still optimistic. It looks like she’s not going to quit. I guess I don’t see what strategy there is for her, unless she’s thinking to push for a no endorsement. Ken Sanguin says we may be behind, but the clock has not run out. What does that mean? Suggests to me that Bonoff will fight this to the bitter end, as I suspected, and push for a no-endorsement. This means war. Madia folks can’t let them steal this from us. I knew she wouldn’t do the graceful thing and exit. What point is there staying in this now other than pushing a no-endorsement. She has no chance of getting the endorsement herself. Thoughts?
Amazing. Sanguin still thinks that Bonoff can win. This is going to be a fight all the way to the convention. Looks like they are going to push hard for no endorsement.
Ken Sanguin, campaign manager for Bonoff, said the race was “far from over,” noting that Madia will have to get the vote of 60 percent of delegates at the district convention.
“This election is too important and we are confident that when the dust settles, and the delegates have a chance to spend more time talking to both candidates, Terri will be their choice,” said Sanguin in a statement.
Sanguin is paid to say that!
Job security!
Attended the HH Dinner this evening. Heard Bonoff was there but she wasn’t pressing the flesh and working the room. Word has it that she purchased just 2 tickets for the dinner. Madia, on the other hand, was one of the financial contributors for the dinner and purchased a table. He was seen pressing the flesh and working the room like a winner.
I hope Bonoff decides to do the right thing and leave graciously “for the good of her family and her senate seat”. It would be sad if she decided to fight this to the bitter end and have it damage the 43rd seat.
Terri has lost this race to the endorsement and should bow out gracefully for the sake of her seat in 43.
Ken Sanguin is a really nice guy who does what he is paid to do, and that is always spin the news to his candidates favor.
Read this post on delegate numbers, and one has to realize that those super delegates are lost to Terri. They either will be no shows or jump the sinking ship.
Ash has real delegate numbers, and Terri’s are padded with votes that cannot be guaranteed.
Wonder if Sanguin gets paid well enough to convince the candidate that she can prevail in a primary? Especially since she voted like a ‘moderate’ to keep taxes low for the upper income Minnesotans last year?
Yeah, I know Sanguin is paid to say that. But, it shows what the Bonoff camp is thinking. Doesn’t look like they’ll go quietly. My sense and sources tell me that they will push for a no-endorsement. Others?
Hopefully a long hard night of sleeping on the last three weeks will let reality sink in for Bonoff. I’d also suggest that her fundraising may be a little less easy with her 10 straight losses…..
Sooner, rather than later, that will have to hit home. She has to realize that hanging in there for the long haul and fighting tooth and toenail will hurt her senate seat.
I have no sources. I think she’ll drop. She’ll fail at a bid for no endorsement.
Look they have too much money at stake in this. I don’t think they bow out gracefully. I think they will take this to the endorsement, and fight hard for a no-endorsement. If they were thinking of bowing out they would not have made such a strong statement today.
Ash needs 1-2 of the supers to come out for him publicly Monday. Just like Obama started to get supers to come out for him. If the supers privately affirm their support to Bonoff, and no one jumps ship, she will fight this for a no-endorsement. We can’t count her out — and rest on our laurels.
I’ve researched Sanguin and heard from many in the district about him. Earlier I posted he was a joke. I stand corrected. he’s formidable. They will find a way to fight for a no-endorsement. Sad for the party, but possible.
I also had some heavy hitters tell me today that Madia has run the best campaign they have seen in a long time. Proof of that might be that the Bonoff campaign started copying some of the things that the Madia camp has been doing so successfully.
I have always felt that a well run campaign tells a lot about the candidate, and Madia’s has been brilliant.
I don’t think he will have any problem raising the money he will need for the general election!
Oh, I am one of those middle class soccer moms that certain people don’t think will support Madia. The one that doesn’t understand the electorate is Bonoff!
From all the stuff I’ve seen, Madia’s been very civil toward both
Hovland and Bonoff, “Mayor Hovland, Sen. Bonoff, our legislative delegation and hundreds of hard-working activists have helped us strengthen our party in areas where Democrats were once few and far between. We can win this fall because they laid the groundwork.”
(from an e-mail I received today)
Bonoff cannot win, all she can do is perhaps prevent Madia from reaching 60% - he already has a majority. I hope it will be civil.
My best guess is that some of these “super delegates” who all seem
to be lined up behind Bonoff, will either urge her out, or just
decide to stay home April 12. They all have to run in this district
too (ie Republicans who overrode Transportation veto). Give her a
couple of days to talk to people, seriously look at the hole she’s
in and hopefully she’ll keep us out of the mud.
Let’s get on to getting some of that national $$ in here and beating
up on the guy we should all be beating up on.
Now, here’s my pet peeve. Why is 20% of National Democratic Party
“Super Delegates”?! That sucks! 3rd CD has about 13% “super delegates”. That sucks too. My first thought is lets get rid of them, but then they’ll end up running for (and probably winning because everyone already knows them) these elected seats. So how do
we prevent them from doing the Republican thing and steal elections from the will of the people. Except for Gary Hart, who earned it, we really haven’t had that problem yet, but to my way of thinking, that’s Republican, not Democratic. But then the founding father’s wanted a republic because one was only good enough to vote if they were a propertied white male, so maybe we should all be Republicans.
My thought is that if we cut down on the who is (leaving in only elected officials), made their votes only count as .5, and not allow them to run for elected seats, we could certainly reduce their power to overturn the will of the people. Thoughts…
I disagree, southwestdem. Terri understands her constituency very well. She made one crucial mistake. She allowed others to convince her that her constituency was the 3rd CD rather than SD43. She won SD43 (by 2 delegates) whereas she has lost everything else. The thing is - she’s not the demographic that will win in the general election in the 3rd. A US Marine, attorney, with experience in working with international agencies is…..
Just sign me another one of those middle-aged soccer mom’s for Madia.
Some asked for CD6 numbers — in SD49, it looks like El Tinklenberg got 7 of 9 elected delegates.
If you make it this low in the comments thread.
Joe:
You seem to have the most inside information on this blog. Do you see Terri dropping or taking this to a convention fight for no-endorsement.
I’ll post a full commentary on the pledged delegate results over at MN Campaign Report tomorrow — it’s sort of late here, and I have some phone calls to make to folks back home to get their impressions of the results and see if any of the uncommitted delegates can be pegged one way or the other. But my initial impression is that she’ll probably soldier on until the convention and let the first ballot happen.
But many scenarios are possible. I’ll outline them in the morning if these Publius shenanigan-makers don’t beat me to it :)
Despite the pro-Bonoff speak, I really think that Madia will fare better in the general election. Terri really needs to do what is best for the party and bow out gracefully and get behind Ashwin’s candidacy. Madia simply has a better message and will appeal more to independents and those who normally don’t vote than Terri can. I think this endorsement is Madia’s, and it’s time to move on.
If Sanguin Says - Fight for a primary — ->>>> Guaranteed paycheck for another 4 weeks.
If Sanguin Says - We give up — ->>>> Unemployed until the next campaign seasaon ???
Another side to Sanguin’s job situation, he’s a strong DFL organizer. Advising her to fight on and damage her reputation as a strong DFL’er will lessen his chances of employment in the future with other DFL campaigns. He has many things to think about….not just the next 3 weeks paychecks.
Terri has a lot to consider - her ego (which seems to be huge), her realistic chances (small to none), and the damage to her senate seat (could be huge if she is seen by her constituency, i.e., SD43, as not wanting to work for them but willing to do anything to get out of that senate seat, and the money. Loosing 10 straight in this race of 12 (with 1 tie) isn’t going to be conducive of fundraising.
Her spend rate must be enormous. She has sent so much color lit out, has a ton of paid staff, has tons of signs, etc. I can’t see that she’s flush with cash.
And, for a candidate who was more than happy to take massive amounts of DFL help and money to be elected in both her previous races to now push for no endorsement shows no respect for the party, the different party entities and all the DFL volunteers who worked to support her. I would have to say I would lose all respect for her, and any person who’s a party officer who stayed involved with her campaign. Can’t have it both ways.
Ken Sanguin understands very well that this is not the last campaign he will ever work on, and he will choose wisely. He is well respected by organizers, and unless he wishes to change careers will make decisions that are smart for both him and his candidate.
If Bonoff goes for the crash and burn, I think someone like Sanguin might just quietly leave the campaign and not be tied to that behavior.
epdem is right in that Terri can’t have it both ways. Madia won the vast majority of the senate districts, and he did it in a positive and respectful way. She promised to abide by the endorsement and all heck will break loose if she subverts that process by pushing for a primary.
I heard several times at SD-33 people saying, “I wish we had these two candidates years ago.” The reality is that several people who voted for either candidate, would have happily supported the other candidate in a heartbeat if the alternative wasn’t around.
The party will unify now. Combine that with the incredible turnouts at every SD convention and the DFL will win this fall.
For that reason, Bonoff needs to exit gracefully. Democrats have a tendency to snatch a loss from the jaws of victory. This would be an example. A protracted primary fight … even a fight for the convention could damage that prospective unity. Right now, the real world doesn’t mirror what the comments on this blog have sometimes become — bitter division. But, if Bonoff goes on the attack (which she would need to do to have a chance) she’ll not only jeopardize her own position within the party, she’ll likely destroy the DFL’s opportunity to take the seat. At minimum it snatches a least a month, and possibly 4 or 5 months from focusing the party on winning in November.
She fought well. She made a formidable final stand yesterday. Indeed, I think a lot of people thought it would be closer than it was at the beginning of the day. But, her efforts didn’t pan out. Probably after the delegates saw for themselves both candidates for the first time.
It’s time to direct the DFL energy where it matters.. against the GOP.
Bonoff’s previous election does not speak to her electability. She merely won against the Michelle Bachman of the western suburbs. Both my wife and I voted against her opponent in that race.
Nonetheless, at SD43 a week ago, after hearing Bonoff speak, my middle class soccer mom wife turned to me and remarked privately that Bonoff’s speaking ability was downright embarassing, and that she just couldn’t see Bonoff getting elected to the U.S. Congress.
And I was a bit put off that Bonoff’s message at SD43 seemed to be, “Vote for me. I’m electable because I’m a soccer mom, and this election is going to be decided by soccer moms.” While being a soccer mom is certainly a plus in my book, it isn’t going to carry the day for a candidate that doesn’t appear to be able to connect with people all that well.
Lastly, I think that the superdelegates should consider how many newcomers Madia has brought into the party vs. Bonoff (whose support seems to be only from the party apparatus itself). Party success in CD3 will come from growing the party base. The DFL should thank Madia rather than trying to squash him as “an outsider.”
Initially I shared some of NorthbyNWDFL’s concerns about Madia, but I find NorthbyNWDFL’s specific reasons a bit funny. While I respect the sentiment, I find it a bit confused to simultaneously attack Madia as unelectable in the district for being a poor match and attack him for not being Democratic enough because of his t-shirts and Iraq plan; frankly, that doesn’t work. The very points that NorthbyNWDFL puts forward as to why he thinks Madia is a Democrat-light are the same reasons that he has a good shot in the 3rd. It will be compelling in the general to tell a story about how he too was a Republican before he shipped off to Iraq and fought in Bush’s war. His personal story is compelling. And most importantly, he’s not an apples to apples comparison with Paulsen; he’s not a politician, he’s a passionate citizen.
But returning to my original point, I had originally thought that Madia was the eminently more electable candidate in the 3rd, but now I don’t think that’s the case at all. It seems as though Madia and Bonoff probably have the same shot, but for entirely different reasons. And, in all honesty, I’m looking forward to the commercial where Madia is speaking to the camera saying, “I used to be a registered Republican but after I shipped off to Iraq I was forced to take a critical look at the radical direction my party had gone. It didn’t happen overnight, but I eventually realized that my party had left me. I always voted for Jim Ramstad for Congress and I hope that you’ll give me the opportunity to continue his tradition of moderate politics in the 3rd by voting for me.” Okay, I got a little too into that, but you get the gist.
Think about it, I really thing it only increases our chances if this race goes to the primary. A better chance for the electorate to see who the two Dem candidates really are without the GOP smokescreen. By the time the primary is over, Paulson and Co. will have very limited time to go on the offensive. Like Matt just said “It seems as though Madia and Bonoff probably have the same shot, but for entirely different reasons. “” which means the MNGOP will be off their game until they can focus on the opposition.
With that said, I think Terri bows out by the end of the week, and if not, Madia gets the endorsement on the 2nd ballot. She has a bright future ahead of her and I don’t think she will want to risk it in a protracted endorsement battle. Flash
It would be ironic and hypocritical for party insiders who tout inclusiveness to ignore 65% of the their own elected committed voice. How can they justify their actions for independent voters and attract them to vote DFL if the insiders still support Bonoff after the overwhelming majority Madia commanded?
I have to disagree about the primary. It hurts us big time to go to a primary because of the timing. Paulsen is already sitting back socking away cash for this race. Being torn apart for an additional five months will only weaken our chances at running a hard race against a flush GOP in protecting a seat that has been “theirs” for years. The only hope is to unite behind a strong candidate and move forward with strong fundraising and media plan to move this seat blue. It can’t be done by running from the left but running from the middle. The further away you get from the Minneapolis border the more comforable people have been with pulling the GOP level in the voting booth. The case has to be made that Madia is a former Republican, has served our country in uniform, can speak to the issues on foreign policy and has a patriotic, strong vision to take this country back. Paulsen can’t compete with that. He is marketing himself as a moderate but he’s anything but. He’s also not universally loved in the GOp since he lost the house majority on his watch and he has a very rightwing voting record that needs to see the light of day. He can only counter Madia’s service in Iraq and Okinawa with a trip to China.
Bring on the GE.
Time for Bonoff to focus on her family and rebuilding the broken connection to her senate seat. I heard several people comment from her district that they were very angry that she had stated openly that she had been planning on running for CD3 congress for a long time - just not this soon. They were angry that she only saw their seat as a stepping stone all along and obviously didn’t care about serving their district in the senate. She needs to turn her attention to those angry constituents now and leave the congressional race to Madia.
Bonoff is not electable. The reason why they are not releasing the raw data of the poll, I beleive, is because the numbers will show that. People in the outlier suburbs, yes even far suburban moms, do not connect with Bonoff.
“likely voters” and “scaling geoghraphically”, which means the raw data was statistically weighted more towards the Minnetonka/Bloomington, thereby giving less significance to other parts of CD3. I’ve heard of “likely voters” as being statistically valid, but “geoghrapic scaling” , no way.
Results of the district conventions show, her support almost disappears in those areas. Despite all that if she is still within the MOE, what does that mean, it means she really did poorly in the raw data and they are massaging it. But then whats new.
I agree with West Metro Dem - I will be very angry if Terri wants to drag CD3 race instead of trying to do the right thing for the party. I was one of those who voted for Bonoff for Senate because it was the right thing to do for the DFL pary. I really liked JJ because of her contributions to us in Plymouth and to our neighborhood. DFL may loose party loyalists, if the top officials/super delegates don’t practice what they preach.
BTW - I am one of those middle aged soccer moms too
If the Bonoff campaign pulls a Hatch and pushes for a primary, why be affiliated with a party and what value does the campaign really put on those of us who are volunteers and contributors? If the endorsement has no meaning, why did so many of us work so hard to make the conventions happen? Pushing for a primary after saying you’ll abide by the endorsement is a slap in every party member’s face.
I personally have seen all the op research on jim ramsted at the dfl. Pretty slim pickens. Why? He was every democrats favorite republican. Terri bonoff could have been every republicans favorite democrat. Ashwin madia can not. That is the plain truth. Ashwin may be a better speaker and energize more democrats. But the 3rd distict is Republican, not purple, not blue. Some need to see this reality. There is a reason that it went republican for the last fifty years. Some of us like to learn from this history, those who do not, such as those that believe madia will win, are doomed to repeat it.
All of you should also remember that Ken Sanguin was a major factor in the landslide victory of Sen Amy Klobuchar. The results were in on that race before polls even closed. Bonoff certainly has a great chance against Paulson, as far as staff goes. Can you imagine if we would have tried to run that race with a lesser candidate? All of the people who think that this party are invincible must be new to politics and never been in a losing democratic campaign, i have been in four, they are hard bitter lessons. while this november may be a large victory for dems, we still need to keep our heads.
I disagree MIchael.
I would consider Ashwin perhaps the most conservative of the three candidates but for social issues such as civil liberties, torture, and LGBT.
He has the most conservative Iraq position
He has the most conservative economic policies
He has the most conservative position related to no child left behind, etc.
Indeed, a lot the reasons that the DFL establishment has not been warm to him is because he’s refused to hold the DFL line on issues like Iraq.
I don’t understand why Bonoff supporters say both he’s not liberal enough, and not electable because he’s not appealing to independents / republicans.
I heard that Zack was on King’s radio show and said Terri Bonoff may be ending her campaign? Is this true, or are these just rumors designed to push her out?
Any Bonoff supporters out there know what she’s thinking? Does she plan to bow out gracefully, and get behind Madia! Or will she fight this in a primary?
Michael — I don’t see how you can claim that Madia CANNOT win. Bonoff’s own poll shows him just 3 points down. And that’s 7 months before the election. So, of course he could win. It’s one thing to say Bonoff has a better chance — an argument I reject. But, on what grounds can you say Madia — a war veteran, excellent speaker, and impressive campaigner who beat the entire DFL establishment — cannot win.
Also, Wellstone for the Heart Forever, any thoughts? Would love to have you on our side now — with Madia — after a tough campaign. It was spirited, but I hope you will get behind Madia as we would have gotten behind Bonoff!
Terri Bonoff is not Amy Klobuchar.
I have many moderate republican friends who will not be swayed by her soccer mom appeal and transportation bill speech. They will listen and relate to Madia because they are fed up with current republican party as well.
Michael,
As much credit as everyone is giving Ken Sanguin for Amy Klobuchar’s win, let’s be honest about it. Amy K had tons of help from Emily’s List (unlike Terri whom they didn’t do anything for until sending one email the night before her last round of conventions) with training and staff - staff that was here on the ground prior to the nomination being sewn up. While Ken may have been “important” in the campaign, the manager during the nomination process was Jessica McIntosh who went on to work on Jim Webb’s campaign after the nomination. Tom Perron (who was Wes Clark’s money man) was Amy K’s money man and still works for Amy today. Amy had lots of national professional staff, not just local organizers. Amy also had a huge group of women called Amy’s Angels who committed each to raise $1m for Amy and that was for starters. There was an initial commitment to belong to the group and to participate in the events of that group. It was a non-standard group of women - business owners, attorneys, bankers, very few party insiders. I know, I belonged.
So, while Ken was an organizer for Amy K, he wasn’t the architect of her win nor was he the driving force. She had tons of outside help from outside the state and would tell you so herself.
Don’t be cocky about working on 4 campaigns. I’ve been at this for 35 years. Lots of people have worked on lots of campaigns - at all levels - and have a different take on this race. In my view (and most of the campaigns I’ve worked on have been in red states and red districts), Terri is the only one who couldn’t win the GE against Paulsen. Madia can and will.
Let’s see. Terri’s public speaking ability vs. her stellar performance in the MN State Senate. Hmm. What issues are you folks really concerned about? What Terri says and does, or simply how she says it? Her record as a state senator clearly indicates leadership capabilities that neither Madia (or most other candidates) can claim. She co-authored and championed a transportation bill that will hopefully keep our bridges from falling on us. She has been a stalwart steward of public education and single moms. She is a natural born leader with a gift of humanity that most of us can only be impressed by.
All of the rhetoric (mostly meaningless) that has evolved on this blog concerning Terri and Ashwin does not in anyway cloud the essential issue that Terri is an experienced politician who has brought nothing other than the positive by her efforts representing her constituency, and this is what she will do in Washington.
As for all of you quitters who are recommending that she quit, go ahead and quit. You obviously do not know Terri and why she has arrived at this moment in time.
Best of luck to both candidates, and I can only hope & pray that a dem will be representing us in the end. This country must shed it’s chains placed upon us by Republican mismanagement, and that’s why I support and believe in Terri Bonoff.
When Bonoff authored the “Grieving Parent Bill,” most likely was the beginning of the end of support from Emily’s List.
A dear out of state friend, who is a heavy donor to Emily’s List, has their own personal contact when a question about a candidate’s pro choice integrity is involved. Emily’s list had already heard of Bonoff’s bill. The response they gave my friend was, “We feel that Terri was naive in authoring this bill, however they wouldn’t take the endorsement away, but wouldn’t get much help from the organization.”
You may define “help†as you wish.
41% of this district is loyal Republican.
If Obamamania wins the primary, there may very well be some new voters coming out for the Blue. But lets not forget that John McCain has an ability to bring back the moderate Republican — that is a key reason why he won the nomination over a guy like Huckabee. Also, there is no George Bush to vote against this year, as there were in the past two major elections.
This has nothing to do with Madia vs. Bonoff, but I wouldn’t underestimate the organization that Paulsen has been able to build while this gets all of the press. I was at an event recently (a non-political one with a cross section of incomes and professions, all 3rd CD residents) and I was caught a little off guard by the buzz around Paulsen and how many had been attending an event of his or pitching in to his campaign.
My point is to echo one made by Michael which was quickly brushed aside: This district is still red, and I haven’t seen anything to show me Madia or Bonoff will decidedly appeal to the moderate.
Blogger,
To that point….the moderate and GOP’er are very pro-country, pro-patriotism and pro-veteran. That alone will swing a percentage Madia’s way. The ability to speak from first hand experience is important when arguing against a longtime GOP’er who has never crossed the aisle - contrary to his personal opinion. That doesn’t work for Bonoff to her favor. She has absolutely nothing to offer the other 10 senate districts who voted against her already moving forward. A 2 year state senator from a well to do suburban family in a well to do district doesn’t resonate with most CD3 people in the middle and on the right. It’s the ability to frame this election and run with strong DFL principles while not running against the beliefs of the district that is vital. Running to secure the borders, support our troops, bring them home responsibly, stand up and be proud for America again, get America moving, etc. It’s being FOR America and not AGAINST everything (like Bonoff).
Blogger:
If there is so much buzz for Paulsen, why is he only up 3% to Madia in the polls. This early in the game that has to be very encouraging for the Democrats.
I live in Paulsen’s house district and have been involved in campaigns that have been run against him. Paulsen is no moderate, although he’ll be working like crazy to make himself appear that way. He’s definitely no Ramstad (although Ramstad in the Delay years wasn’t Ramstad either, but people failed to pay attention to the shift in voting patterns). He comes across as the “awww, shucks, I’m just a family guy” Boy Scout. But, is really a career politician who hates to be called that (but what else is someone who’s done nothing else since college. There’s work at Target, but the majority of energy has been with Ramstad and then 12 years in the State House - including years as Steve Sviggum’s House Majority Leader.
If the 3rd CD conducts a primary because Bonoff won’t abide by the endorsement process, this congressional seat will be back in the republicans hands again for another 30 years.
Minnesota doesn’t require constituent’s to register for a political party. The republicans will cross over in the primary and vote for the most vulnerable candidate, Bonoff. Only when Minnesota legislates that we have to be registered with a political party to vote primaries and elections would I ever support this.
Elections are expensive and the 3rd CD DFL will have to pay for the primary. We need to keep that money to support our endorsed candidate. The 3rd CD doesn’t need to cater to a candidate that can’t accept the fact that there is a much more viable candidate, Ashwin Madia.
Fair point WDM, but I’m not trying to get involved in the Bonoff / Madia infighting, I’m more making the point for the general, since that discussion has crept into this thread.
For most Republicans, even those disenchanted with Bush/Cheney/Rove, electing a Democrat to this long-Republican seat would be too extreme a measure. It would be throwing the baby out with the bathwater. Paulsen is capable and could serve well.
If I were advising either part in this race, I’d say go for the middle 24%. You ain’t going to convert the bases. Each party, with Obama and McCain, will strengthen their bases if anything from where we stood in 2006.
Ah, epdem, let’s not forget that while Paulsen was toiling away in the state house - proving his fabulous leadership skills - he lost the house majority. Couldn’t be too comforting, could it?
Blogger,
Agree with you. It is about the mushy middle. But, for a district that has always trended right and is just trending blue, a comforting compromise is to have someone strong on defense and strong on making American proud again with service to his country under his belt. The fact that Madia has actually worked with (not toured to see) a war zone and international agencies is to his credit.
There are always going to be base voters on both sides. The issue is how large the middle is and how to appeal to those voters.
“There are always going to be base voters on both sides. The issue is how large the middle is and how to appeal to those voters.”
Bingo. We’ll know the answer in November.
What is fascinating is to compare the reception that Ashwin Madia is getting from the DFL power-brokers and party insiders with the reception that Andrew Borene received when he ran for State Senate.
Both Madia and Borene are well educated, both are lawyers, both served in the armed forces, and both were Repubicans turned Democrats. Early on Borene had big names not serving on his campaign committee - Wendell Anderson came out for a fundraiser and spoke on his behalf. This happened after Borene made some amazing errors as a candidate - he accused Geoff Michel of not marching in the Edina 4th of July parade - he participated in a back and for kind of “oh yeah?” letter writing campaign in the local newspapers. In the end his campaign came to a halt and he had to drop out. He was charged with 5th degree assault. It was a charge that resulted from a fight with his wife.
Now here’s where things get really strange - Borene is in DC and according to his Linked In page he is serving as an adviser for Terri Bonoff for U.S. Congress. So…well where to start? Lots of questions…can anyone from team Bonoff clarify exactly what Borene is doing and whether Terri intends to make him one of her key players? Is the Democratic Party still investing in Borene?
The DFL made the Borene campaign a priority - he received I believe a full-time staffer. If Madia gets the DFL nomination will the party change its tune and start sending a little support his way? Or will the DFL severely limit funding to his run? Now is the time to start asking these questions….
Demure One,
In defense of the party, there is a huge difference between a targeted state race (like Borene’s last cycle) and a federal legislative race like Madia’s. All in all, the party has been pretty hands off on the federal races until the nominee in chosen. Remember the questions surrounding Keith Ellisons’ endorsement race and why the party wasn’t involved more?
I do hope that others would take note, though, of Terri’s “military advisor” in the form of Andrew Borene. Andrew lives in DC, works for Lexis Nexus and has very minimal involvement in Minnesota these days. How he can be her advisor is interesting to me. I would submit it was one of those “names” to get on board like so many others.
Think Madia is a Democrat?! Read on…This is straight from Wikepedia.
Ashwin Madia Biography
Ashwin Madia’s parents moved to America from Mumbai, India. They had only $19 in cash when they first arrived. Madia’s family settled in Plymouth, Minnesota, where he went to Osseo Senior High School. He attended the University of Minnesota, where he became student body president. While in this position, he worked to cap tuition increases and fees going to La Raza Student Cultural Center and The Queer Student Cultural Center[4]. Madia’s early politicl leanings were with the GOP where he praised Bob Dole and criticized President Bill Clinton. He also criticized the National Education Association, and teachers as the reason for students failure and called for grants to private schools. Madia also predicted Social Security going bankrupt by 2013, and called for reductions in programs like SS and Medicare on behalf on his generation supporting the babyboom generation. [5] He then attended New York University School of Law.
Madia then joined the U.S. Marine Corps completing basic training in Quantico, Virginia. His first duty station was Okinawa, Japan, where he served as a prosecutor, defense counsel, and legal advisor to a Marine Corps commander.
Madia later served in Iraq from September 2005 to March 2006. While there, he worked to strengthen Iraq’s criminal justice system. This job included working with Iraqi judicial officers, U.S. military and civilian officials, and representatives of the European Union and United Nations, as well as briefing top U.S. generals on the status of the rule of law in the country. In July 2006, Madia finished active duty and returned to Minnesota, where he began to work at a local law firm.
The Real Madia
Let’s hope people can change
If you need more proof that nothing in the world happens by chance, I submit to you that it has literally been years since I read the Daily. I happened to pick up Tuesday’s Daily and saw the article concerning former MSA President Ashwin Madia (“Former MSA president vies for Congress,” Oct. 30), who was known as Jigar Madia while a student at the U.
I about choked on my lunch when I saw that Jigar was running as a DFLer. As MSA President, Jigar was an active member of the College Republicans, virulently homophobic and a staunch enemy of mandatory student fees. He was no friend to the cultural centers. In essence, he was the perfect conservative poster child.
I was a member of MSA and was once given an award by Jigar as having the best knowledge of the MSA Constitution and By-Laws, which I used (constantly) to stop Jigar and his friends from gutting free speech and freedom of expression, in as much as MSA had such power (mainly through the vehicle of the Student Service Fees Committee).
I believe all people have the ability to change. And I hope that Jigar’s, excuse me, Ashwin’s are much more than a change in preferred name and other cosmetic expressions.
Brandon Lacy Campos
former CLA Student Senator
CLA Class of 2001
Demure One -
Money will pour into the Democratic nominees coffers from every corner of the country, trust me. There will be plenty of cash flying in this race.
By the time its all said and done, questions about someone like Borene will be the least of the DFL’s worries. With the volume of money about to come pouring in from “the machine” on both sides, there will no doubt be some donors with shady links or questionable pasts that the candidates will need to address. That will go for both sides.
Andrew Borene, as Bonoff’s military advisor didn’t seem to help her much when it came to securing the DFL Veteran’s Caucus endorsement. Go read her questionnaire answers at the website http://www.mndflvets.org .
It’s easy to understand why so many people, especially Veterans are behind Ashwin Madia. When it comes to Veteran’s Issues, Madia understands the difference between the wars we are fighting and how we should be truly taking care of our returning soldiers.
Don’t worry about party support for Madia. As one of the top 5 targeted races in the country, it will get lots of attention!
OK,
Here’s what I posted at MnBlue. I’ll repost it verbatim, because it’s short, simple, and to the point:
The battle for endorsement in Minnesota’s 3rd Congressional District is over; Madia’s Marauders have prevailed. The only thing remaining is ratification of the victory at the Convention, on April 12th.
Ok, sure – Captain Madia doesn’t have the 96 necessary delegates – he’s only got 84.5 of the caucus attending elected delegates marching in his formation. The point is, those 84.5 delegates represent way more than 60% of the elected delegate total.
For Senator Bonoff to win endorsement, she has to convince superdelegates to ignore the will of the people; convince the superdelegates to ignore the election results that are on paper and in the record books. And that’s just for starters.
Just as that will NOT be acceptable to Democrats in the Presidential race, that will NOT be acceptable to Democrats in the 3rd Congressional district. I am guessing the superdelegates will be inundated with e-mails and phone calls, telling them that the people have spoken, they have spoken loudly, and they have spoken convincingly. The message they will be conveying is in cases like this, it’s the superdelegate’s duty to ratify the will of the people.
I admire Senator Bonoff. She’s won two tough races in this district. But the people have spoken. Louldly. Clearly. Frequently. Convincingly.
The race was over, one week ago. The results yesterday merely confirmed that. The Convention on April 12 will only make it official.
The endorsement race is over. It’s time to rally the troops, and prepare for the next battle.
Madia reminds me scarily of Norm Coleman. Whatever way the political wind is blowing, he positions himself to take advantage of it. While a College Republican at the University of MN and the GOP were firmly in control of the White House and both houses of Congress - Madia was Republican, first supporting Bob Dole and then John McCain and I’d be willing to bet he voted for Bush in 2004. Now that the tide is turning in the Dems favor, the ever personally ambitious Madia is suddenly a progressive Democrat. He supported doing away with Social Security (hear that seniors) and he supported ended Medicare (strike two). Not exactly progressive views, Ash.
The thinking that his “Iraq War veteran” background will hold sway with these voters, denies the fact that in reality he spent seven months as a “lawyer” in Iraq (although in his bio he claims to have been a Marine for four years - deployed to Iraq). Unless you read carefully you might think he spent four years there in combat. Not true.
What is he doing now? Well, he’s an unemployed lawyer. That’s impressive.
Madia dances around whether he supported invading Iraq. He can’t give a straight answer, because if he did, he’d reveal his true Right Wing leanings. Otherwise, how can he explain his decision to join the war once it started? What’s the story, Ash?
If the DFL ends up endorsing Madia we will see this seat go to the GOP and we all know how hard it is to defeat an incumbent. Endorsing Madia is playing right into the GOP’s hands - just what they want.
I am amused how you all constantly keep referring to “the will of the people”, as if conventions which at most encompass 6% of registered voters is somehow the will of the people.
Having this go to the primary would be to listen to the will of the people. Only then will you know what the will of the people is.
If you want to get Madia over the top, fine by me. That is the way the system works. But stop referring to it as the will of the people. It is the “will of the majority of the 6% of population who are DFL party activitists”.
Call it what it is.
Spot on quote from Doug Grow at MinnPost:
“Hovland is a good fit for district but apparently not for delegates. In fact, he may be a perfect fit for the district.
But he’s not a perfect fit with the activists who take the time to involve themselves in party conventions.”
I can’t say it any better than Grow can.
So, DantheMan, we should change the rules mid-process. And, this with the massive turnout at caucuse. 32,000 in the 3rd, over 4x the 2004 turnout. So, all those new people are “party activists”? And, those of us who’ve only been involved for a cycle are “party activists”? I don’t think so.
A primary fractures things. And, the threat of a primary gave us Mike Hatch and not Steve Kelley. How do you stop Republican votes for the candidate they feel is the “easiest mark” in the general election.
Sorry, won’t buy that bill of goods this time.
Dantheman: I don’t mean to sound huffy, but the future belongs to those who show up. 100% of voters could of had a say if they went to precinct caucuses and onward with delegate selection. I have no pity for those whom stayed home, or drank beer at the bar that night. This was an open processes.
I believe I read Andrew Borene’s title as ‘National Security Advisor’ to Terri Bonoff.
And why does she need one?
Well, to interpret a National Intelligence Estimate for her, perhaps.
Ashwin Madia said at a candidate forum in December that he promised to read any NIE before a vote and study the issue thoroughly.
And who do you think he needs to interpret it for him?
Well, I think he can comprehend it by himself, having served in Iraq and advising Iraqis on the rule of law.
Please re-read my post. I’m not saying we should change, in fact I’m generally agreeing that Madia has all the momentum.
I’m just taking issue with this being labeled “the will of the people”. The will of the people happens in a Primary and General.
You are all openly saying you want to avoid a Primary. What are you afraid of? That would be the will of the people.
It is valid to make a point that anyone could show up at a Primary. But to tell an Independent, which by many accounts is the largest voting bloc out there, that they have to choose a highly partisan forum to express their “will” — that is flawed.
The future belongs to those who show up. And for the vast, vast majority of people in the 3rd, they exercise that right at 1) a primary or 2) a general.
(I used 30,000 as my basis for my “6%” figure. So maybe its closer to 7%).
I am a first time delegate to the 3rd and state convention. I got elected because I was at my caucus and express an interest. At my SD convention I ran and got elected after I gave a 1 minute speech about the issues that mattered to me.
I can’t tell you how many people I have met since then that are first timers. This is grassroots at its best!
While I admit I am politically active, in no means am I a “back room activist” as I think you are trying to imply.
My precinct caucus had 37 people in 2004 and 156 in 2008. I would say lots of people are energized, and they are all democrats!
If this state goes to a primary system, then I say lets all register by party and then make sure no one can change that affiliation the day of an election, so there are no shenanigans at the polls.
As for the Democrats having a party primary, why should we do what you republicans want and have chaos in our party with you and others subverting the process?!
And why should we give your candidate a huge lead in fundraising and campaigning?
Joe:
I noticed you changed the count and have it as Bonoff 66, Madia 84.5. Is this accurate, or the count above? It makes quite a difference as Bonoff at 66 gives her over 40% if they stick with her. I am curious about your analysis, and state of the race.
I’ve heard conflicting things. Some say Bonoff will drop. Others say she is already gearing up for a primary, and had a strong fundraising quarter. Thoughts?
“While I admit I am politically active, in no means am I a “back room activist†as I think you are trying to imply.”
All I am saying, and this is really all I am saying, is that 6-7% of registered voters are involved in deciding the candidate. If we had a true primary, the number involved in choosing candidates could very well be 5-10 times what it is with today’s delegate system.
Dan,
Don’t you think that if Obama is the nominee, his wave will carry Ash over the top.
Super Delegates fortunately in this case have a perspective, which Madia supporters do not. Many of the new delegates supporting Madia are first timers. It’s great to see them involved, but they are denying the fact that he has never won an election (unless you count at the U of M) in his life. I’d put Bonoff’s record and experience against Madia, anytime. If you look at Bonoff’s endorsements against Madia’s it’s obvious that other DFL Party leaders recognize this as well. They know who can win.
Madia has built a admirable grass roots group of supporters. But, unfortunately they are not experienced in what it takes to win a general election. Plus, besides being an “Iraqi Vet” what other experience can he point to that gives him the credentials to win? Nothing. Nada. Zip.
Maybe Madia should get some experience, actually be active in the DFL and prove that his conversion to being a Democrat is more than just a politically convenient move.
No.
The thing to remember is that McCain has appeal to the moderate wing of the Republican and old IR camps. While that won’t rival what Obama will do for voting numbers nationally, in a district like the 3rd with lots of Independents and IRs, I think it offsets Obamamania.
If this was Ellison’s district or McCollums district, I’d have a different answer. I’d agree that Obamamania will bring many new voters out, while McCains effect would be muted.
Plus, this district already gets something like 80% voter turnout in Presidential elections. How much higher can you go?
If there is a wave that gets Bonoff / Madia / Hovland (if this goes to primary don’t count him out) into office, it will be the economy, not Obama.
Doug Grow - “Madia continued his relentless drive to endorsement ”
The word “relentless” says it all.
The current delegate conventions were attended by a far more representative sample of the population than any one ever before.
Actually I doubt any primary would attract more voters than this years caucuses. It took me 1/2 hr just to get in.
There is a sizeable number of Republicans who wanted McCain in 2000, became disenchanted with the way Bush got the 2000 nomination and the way Bush governed. Those people will be back in 2008.
And there are enough Republicans who firmly believe McCain is crazy and they’ll be there to stop him (my very Republican mother for one).
DantheMan:
Excellent points. You’re analysis is quite objective, and I respect it. So, you still think there is a shot this goes to a primary?
Do you know whether Obama carried CD3 significantly in the caucus against Hillary? It would be interesting to know who won.
I agree that the economy may be decisive not just in this election but nationally.
“Actually I doubt any primary would attract more voters than this years caucuses. It took me 1/2 hr just to get in.”
I think just about any contested primary would trounce this caucus system that draws 6-7% of voters. Heck, 2006’s primary which was a non-presidential year and had Ramstad running as the presumptive General winner drew nearly 10%.
I want to clarify my argument here. I’m not necessarily saying that it would be best for this to go to a primary in 2008. I’m not necessarily saying that this race isn’t leaning heavily toward Madia. I would like to move to a primary system, but now is the wrong time to do it.
What I’m saying is that this system which uses 6-7% of registered voters to choose a partisan candidate is NOT the will of the people. It is the agreed upon system in place today. But not the will of the people.
The will of the people occurs in September and then again in November. I personally would love to see Hovland getting back into the General as an Independent and running as the moderate he is (you listening Jim? If so, I’ll think twice about supporting Paulsen). That would be a true barometer of how the people feel.
I can hear the campaign spot now:
“Hi, I’m Jim Hovland, and I want to represent you in Washington. I’m a local Mayor and businessperson, and for years identified with the Republican Party. Since the latest Administration took over, however, I’ve found my views alienated by the party.
I took my moderate views to the DFL, and asked if they would embrace me. They didn’t.
So now I’m coming to you as an Independent, in the tradition of Jim Ramstad and Bill Frenzel. I will represent you in Washington in a way becoming of the 3rd CD — with logic, reason, and centricity.
I ask for your support as the moderate candidate in this race.”
Let me respond. My mention of the number of campaigns was simply about the fact that although candidates may have all the qualities we want, they often still lose if they are in a tough district. And when i say ashwin is too liberal, i mean economically. T Bonoff has the support of the chamber of commerce for god sakes, she knows exactly who to sway in that district. And for her prior wins, she won in republican districts. Ash madia, for all his qualities, of which there are many, has held no important office. Remember, even if he were to win, and that will be tough, there is a hard learning curve in the congress. Also, be sure that if he did win, it would be harder for him to hold that seat than bonoff or paulson. I am trying to make valid points here, and while there have been good responses, others simply are not taking a sober look at this race. I know that polls show ash madia barely down in a race against paulson, so how would that make you then want madia? you think he can make up that lead, perhaps, but the republicans will tear him to shreds before it is over. He will have to explain his odd political past views, that really do not mesh with the whole, my parents came to here with $19 in their pockets. My point is, this seat is going to be the toughest fight we have outside the senate race. the republicans across the country were hoping j ram would stay, but now they know he will not, they will pour endless amounts of cash to keep the spot.
Michael, Ashwin talks about balancing the budget and being fiscally conservative. He has less labor support than Bonoff. How do you say that he is economically more liberal?
Who do you think the Repubs would rather run against?
So, what are you advocating — that Bonoff take this to a primary. Do you think we’ll have any chance then?
I respect your analysis. Ro
Actually the DCCC is flush with money to fight these targeted races, too. With Paulsen’s record of loosing the house majority (failure to lead effectively) against Ash’s leadership in Iraq, work in foreign duty stations (Okinawa and Baghdad with multinational organizations versus Paulsen’s trip to China), and Ash’s former Republican roots, I don’t see this as a GOP seat in the future. I actually do understand the GOP quite well. This is an imminently winnable seat with Ash. It will matter how issues are framed and how outreach is effected as well as getting the message out. Ash is exceptionally powerful at staying on message and articularly clearly his issues. I can’t say the same for Paulsen. He’s rather painfully boring, quite honestly (and yes, I do know him).
Just got on, let’s see if I have the story straight.
In what some are still calling a red district, Madia
is opportunistic by running as a liberal Democrat while
we think he is still really a Republican. Is that
because Bonoff was easier to take out than Paulsen,
or is it because the Republicans really just want two
choices in November?
“What is he doing now? Well, he’s an unemployed lawyer. That’s impressive.”
Unemployed because he chose to leave his position to focus on his run for Congress. I’d say, what he’s doing now, namely, winning 10 of 12 senate districts (coming in a tie with the 11th, and nearly beating Terri in her home district in the 12th) is quite impressive.
The GOP thinks this is a difficult district for them to win this time. I can just thank heavens that the Dem party is a large tent that doesn’t have a litmus test for joining - nor a time requirement. The Dem party I belong to accepts newcomers without litmus tests….people like Jim Hovland, Ash Madia, and many others.
The GOP is very worried about this district, otherwise it would not be considered one of the top 5 in the country.
Erik Paulsen himself states that this will be a close race, so he is not taking it for granted. He even asked the senate district to have 2 conventions, and not endorse for the State Rep seat until AFTER the 3rd CD GOP Convention. Doesn’t sound like someone secure in his chance to win a party endorsement, much less an election.
The reality is, many more people caucused for the Democrats than republicans on February 5. While the DFL Conventions all around the 3rd have been drawing record crowds, the republicans have been hosting small events in conference rooms (like the one in Grace Church in 42) for their conventions.
I think that the Minnesota DFL is representing the will of many more people than the current GOP in this election cycle. Don’t think that will change before November.
And I believe that Obama took the 3rd by a large margin.
OH — WMD — my parents are very consevative republicans and they will not vote for a single republican in November!
They are so angry and disappointed with the GOP that they are voting for Democrats up and down the ticket for the first time in 30 years.
They also think John McCain is crazy….and too old.
“they will pour endless amounts of cash to keep the spot.”
They don’t have endless amounts of cash.
D-trip is out raising the NRCC by scads. In fact, the D-trip has ten times the cash on hand.
http://www.mydd.com/story/2007/7/12/16374/4453
Also the NRCC is under internal investigation for money transfers. I wouldn’t be surprised if all their assets would soon be frozen due to a federal investigation. http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/03/13/AR2008031302841.html?nav=rss_business
I had a friend point me to this website a couple of weeks ago as a way to gather more information about this congressional race. I only went to caucuses to support Barak Obama I was not interested in any of the other races.
I support Barak is because of his positive vision for the future.
Reading these comments you people have clearly lost that sense of positivity.
Go back and re-read what you’re writing. Nobody here is trying to persuade anybody. I don’t even know if that is your intention. Many of you are just going out of your way to tear each other down and one up another with witty comments.
My friend works with one of the congressional races and was clearly trying to prove a point about their candidate by directing me to this website.
Unfortunately during my brief time here the only point that has been made to me on this website is that you are all very negative people.
I have read how much people love to respond to comments to draw people into fights around here so I will let you know that I will not be returning to this website to read how you attack my reply nor will I be around to answer any hostile, leading questions.
I just wanted to let you know that all of the fighting here is turning people off. I will continue to get my political information the old fashioned way- by reading the newspaper and visiting campaign websites.
100 comments of complaining and most of you say that Barak is your inspiration. You should be ashamed of yourself.
FirstTimer gets the award for the most intelligent post of the day!
Thanks for a little sensibility and a distinct lack of boobery FT — come on back.
In the meantime you bickering nimcompoops should do something productive for Minnesota’s potential congressional delegation and go vote for Steve Sarvi here, before you post your next comment.
Wow! For someone whose blog used to invite discussion on local topics, that post really is the end Sean. Apparently discussion - positive and negative - isn’t wanted here.
Please consider….voted for Steve Sarvi, sat on the endorsing committee for the DFL Veterans Caucus that gave him their endorsement (as well as Al Franken and Ash Madia) and donated to him through ActBlue.
I love discussion — I love intelligent, honest discussion of the pros and cons of our candidates, our issues and our campaigns.
What the folks on this thread and the other threads devoted to the 3rd have done, isn’t that. It’s usually half-informed, fear baiting, occasionally bordering on slanderous idiocy. And yes, this cuts both ways. Between the ignorant boobery about Madia’s political conversion[1], the stupidity about his shirts being made in Honduras[2], the mindless insults directed towards Bonoff’s staff [3] and enough uninformed comments about the endorsement process to make my hack head spin.
I love dicussion — I hate dumb, and sorry WMD the comment section about the 3rd CD race can get real dumb.
Sean
[1]which by the way, I’d like to remind everyone that one of the dirty liberal posters on this blog was a Republican just about as recently as Madia was.
[2]in case anyone was curious — if you should happen to find a shirt that says “Made In America” it probably wasn’t made in America. It was probably made in the Mariana Islands, a US territory where people work in sweatshop like conditions — basically no better than anything that could have come out of Honduras, and in a real irony, the recent increase in minimum wage was specifically applied to the Marianas islands, you’ll be seeing a lot less tshirts saying “Made in America”.
[3]Ken Sanguin has taken enough belts on here from nimrods who wouldn’t know him from Adam. But what they should know about Ken is that there is probably no one in the state who has done as much for youth organizing as he has. In 2006 his support and advocacy within the Klobuchar campaign made youth organizing a priority within that campaign and also in the coordinated DFL campaign — the Youth Coordinated Campaign that Ken championed was unprecedented in the country and was an amazing success.
I can’t believe I read through all of these.
Like I said elsewhere, Terri will run this to the primary. Ken’s statement about how important this election is and blah, blah, blah is really saying the delegates don’t know how important this is and they need a little more time to let them wake up. The ol’ Hillary strategy.
Ken Sanguine wasn’t even living here before this. Terri brought him back from where ever he was living to work on this campaign. He had already moved on so, looking for favor within the DFL or hoping not destroy his political career is not a consideration as he lives out east and has moved on. He moved away after Amy won.
This seems to be a year for challenging and beating the establishment as well as the opposition.
True, we have been tearing each other down. Let me turn to issues then. I do not understand the Madia position of having an extended troop presence in Iraq. Clearly if we want to talk about how the people have spoken, it is against this war. Why keep a mistake going? This is the single issue that brought me to support Bonoff over Madia. Don’t get me wrong, her position is not perfect, but it is in keeping with the pres candidates like obama, who she supported loudly and quickly, who does Madia support? I also do not understand how one can say that the people have spoken. I am quite sure that both campaigns have at least some of their staff as delegates, these are not everyday dems. Furthermore when I was at my own convention I spoke to many Madia supporters who had no clue about his Iraq position, NONE. He is a good man, and a good campaigner, but where he may gain in the moderate vote, he may lose in the anti-war base, which is large. And please, I understand how we can quibble over who has more money coming in and other points, but truth be told I believe Erik Paulsen would rather face a candidate like Madia that Terri B or Jim H. If he is the nominee, he has my support fully and a contribution coming his way from me, but I do think that if there is a primary, it will be for the better.
Actually, Ash Madia’s position on the war is pretty much the same as Hillary and Barack’s. Neither of them will pull all of the troops out of Iraq immediately (as Bonoff says she wants). Both recognize (as Madia has stated multiple times in forums and in the debate as SD42) that some troops must be left behind in order to protect our embassy (we are responsible for protecting our embassies around the world), to pull out our contractors, to pull out our troops safely. It is not a long term presence but the base reality (which both Barack and Hillary have spoken to multiple times, too) that it takes time with the numbers of troops incountry to remove them safely and not leave behind absolute chaos.
It’s Bonoff that has misrepresented Obama’s position on the war. Responsible withdrawal (quick but safe) is the position for both Obama and Clinton - not precipitous withdrawal. We cannot endanger our troops by withdrawing ala Vietnam again.
This reasoned response was one of the prime reasons that Madia received almost 100% of the votes of the DFL Veterans Caucus in their endorsing screening and Bonoff received none. Her position is the unrealistic one on this but makes a good sound byte. His is reasoned, logical and supported by the upper level Dem candidates.
Marc:
What basis do you have for saying that Terri will run this to a primary? How can she block an endorsement at this point — she just doesn’t have the votes, and conventions almost endorse.
This is not an attack — just a request for clarification, and understanding of why you believe what you do.
I’m paraphrasing something I heard Pat Buchanan (of all people)
say today:
The Bush Administration is rushing to the aid of Bear Stearns;
where were they while we were losing 3 million manufacturing jobs?
One need know no more than that, to have enough reason to vote
Democrat. We should hear that to no end for the next 8 months,
and from Democrats, not Republicans.
Why is “Minnesota Democrats Exposed†an obviously anti-DFL site, so positive toward Madia? Just wondering…..
I don’t sense they are positive about Ash Madia. I sense they were anti-Terri and neutral about Hovland. I don’t think they have a handle on this race yet so are frying some other fish while waiting for it to play out. Watch for things to heat up from them once the nominee is known. One thought though….it’s tough for the GOP to argue bitterly against a former US Marine who actually served our country well in Bush’s war. Most of those posters over there are chickenhawks and they don’t like to be reminded of it by real veterans. Hard to argue with patriotism, hard to argue with sacrifice for one’s country, hard to argue with working hard and making oneself a success. They need to wait until it’s definitely Ash and then they’ll start picking apart his policy statements - but I don’t believe they’ll actually try to pick at him personally. It would go against everything they say they stand for….honor, duty, country. Who personifies that better than the US Marines? (Hard for me to say coming from the US Army….but true….sigh)
I was a delegate on Saturday..I did not know that Madia’s experience as a ‘war vet’ did not mean combat. I got the impression he was in combat. Sept 05 to March 06 in Iraq was as a legal advisor?
Any deployment in an active war zone is “combat deployment”. He’s an attorney. He was in Baghdad and other towns helping to rebuild the legal system in Iraq….you know, what we’re supposed to be really doing there. Any time you are deployed to a war zone you are combat trained, can be under fire and carry a weapon. It’s not quite being sent to the Pentagon for your tour of duty. His website is very clear what he was doing in both Okinawa and Baghdad during his overseas deployments. His other duty station was Quantico Marine Corps Base, Virginia.
Interesting question for those in the Bonoff camp who are trying to push the meme that “Madia wasn’t a combat veteran”. Does it matter? Does only service under active fire count? What qualifies as a “war zone” to those who question it? So, is someone who was a Vietnam era vet not a Vietnam vet to you? Does service in Germany not count? Does service in Okinawa not count? Does only service to our country count if someone is actively firing a bullet at you? I would certainly hope this isn’t the case. Service to our country is that. Service. You go where our country asks you to go. You do what is asked of you. If you are under fire, it is worse and the damage lasts forever. Service is service.
The Ten Greatest Moments in Conservative History at the U
[Opinion article originally appeared in edited form in the Minnesota Republic; written by Marty Andrade]
Last month’s midterm elections put Democrats back into power across the nation. It also put a lot of conservative pundits and a lot of Republicans into a malaise. For many Republicans, the last major defeat was Bill Clinton’s re-election in 1996. For over 10 years the GOP was the dominant force in making national policy and since 1998 the GOP has held most of the power in the state of Minnesota. Republicans are going to go from the dominant subject in the media to second fiddle behind the hilarious antics of Nancy Pelosi. I look forward to this but for some younger Republicans and for relative newcomers to politics this represents a dramatic shift in paradigm.
Not for me though. As a campus activist at the U and later as a professional activist traveling from campus to campus I was always facing an overwhelming liberal establishment which worked to control the expression of students to their own desires and beliefs. Having liberals in power was always a special pleasure to me. I thrived on making liberal administrators, activists and staffer cringe with fear. I wasn’t alone; many conservatives in the long history of conservative activism at the University of Minnesota have faced the far left with a mixture of success and irreverence. With great pleasure I give you the ten greatest moments of conservative activism at the University of Minnesota:
Number Ten; Jigar Madia elected MSA president in 1997.
The Minnesota Student Association is the self-proclaimed student government at the U, it has existed for about a half century. The last time an openly Republican candidate was elected president of MSA was in 1960. Ever since then Republican candidates for the spot have either hidden their affiliation and refused official endorsement or they have lost. In the mid-1990’s the College Republicans created a sister group called “Students Against Fee Excess†or SAFE for short. SAFE fought for reduced student fees, and their endorsement served as a politically friendly proxy for the College Republicans. After a few years of trying a SAFE endorsed candidate finally claimed victory in 1997 in the form of Jigar Madia. Jigar was the only SAFE endorsed candidate to ever win the spot. In the years since then only one other candidate has promised a policy of reforming fees, and that is the present MSA president Max Page. Page is also a former (and present?) UDFL chairman.
Seems pretty clear that, rather than being a Democrat (as so many of his supporters have held him out to be), Madia is simply a politician. This is not surprising I suppose, but it certainly seems a bit contrary to the party fervor that has sprung up around his campaign. In the end, no matter what the people on this blog might think, it is going to be very difficult for Madia to win in the 3rd District based on his former political life and lack of relevant experience. I hope Bonoff sticks it out as she is probably the only chance that 3rd District DFLers have in November.
Reality Check,
What alternative universe are you living in? CD3 has voted GOP for the past 30 years or so. Please, explain how being a former Republican who served your country and caused you to re-evaluate your values and party affiliation will disqualify someone to run in the DFL in the 3rd? In reality, being a true blue lifelong DFL’er is the one who will have a hard time in CD3.
FYI….my “kids” are in their 20’s (grad school and senior at the U entering grad school) and they (and we) are against the excess student fees, too. If that makes someone an devil in the past, then most Dems at the UofM are, too. The fees at the U have been excessive and still are.
The GOP won’t be stupid enough to pick apart nuances of Madia’s service. Military service is military service. You have to respect it.
There are plenty of other things they will hammer on, which are easier targets and valid questions. Somehow trying to diminish Madia’s service would royally piss of anyone who has ever served, Republican or Democrat.
DTM - absolutely. That is the one given that will not be messed with. It’s stupid. No one serves in any capacity in the US Marines and takes being picked upon. Nothing would rally veterans on both sides like picking on a US Marine who served in a war zone - independent of the duty.
Reality check,
I’m not sure how fighting for lower student fees equates with not being a democrat or somehow being a politician.
He certainly isn’t hiding this fact. His efforts to reduce student fees at the U is part of his stump speech. It’s even part of his condensed two minute stump speech.
RC
Einning the student body presidency as a Republican in a sea of ultra liberals shows how Captain Madia can win on the basis of his ideas.
Can we say that for Terri Bonoff ?
I’ve heard that Bonoff will take this thing to a primary and the supers are standing strong with her. This is unbelievable that she’s not bowing out, but what I predicted.
I guess Marc was right. Is there anything we Madia forces can do to force the supers to change. I feel like they are stealing this from us by taking this to a primary. Madia will win that, of course, but be weakened for the general. Why are the Bonoff folks so vindictive — do they have no sense of fair play and what is good for the party?
There are about 14 DFL Representatives and some Senators in CD3 running for re-election this fall, looking for support and votes. If they’re going to the wall for Bonoff, then make them pay for it if you feel that strongly about it. The other thing one can do is get on their case personally. I’ve written my Rep to back off Bonoff and get in touch with her District that went Madia 4-1.
Right on WestMetroDem! IED’s go off in the Green Zone too.
The exception to every rule. Kerry - Swift boats.
I agree. Madia has encouraged war on these superdelegates and we should call them and make sure they don’t steal this. This is a challenge against the establishment, and the anti-establishment forces must win! We will prevail. Bonoff won’t be able to send this to a primary. Power to the people. Who the hell cares about the DFL establishment — we won without them!
“Bonoff won’t be able to send this to a primary. Power to the people.”
So in other words: You won’t allow this to go to a primary where as many of 60% of the people would have a say, but instead you want the decision to be made by 6% of the population who closely identify with a certain party. And then you say Power to the People. Interesting.
DantheMan,
In your role as a good DEM who does not like the delegate process - then you should change it.
Don’t whine about the rules now!!!!
If we’re going to a primary system, it should be done after this election cycle. It’s a systemic change and not something to be bandied about loosely. We need to make those changes after the election. A primary (where more than 6% of the people vote) is very expensive when an ADDITIONAL expense added to the caucus/convention system already paid for.
One point to put to your superd’s and reps you call for Ash….exactly how do you propose to go to your constituents and ask for financial help for your campaign when they are made aware that their donations to the party and districts have been wasted because you (their rep) would not bend to the will of the people and forced the district to pay for an additional primary? Remember, the senate districts have already fundraised to pay for the caucuses and conventions. They will incur the cost of an additional primary - a waste of money - money that could be used to elect Dems. If these superd’s want to pay for the primary because of their inability to recognize the results of the caucuses and conventions, then they should pay for it in decreased donations from their constituents. How many do you think will stand with Bonoff if they know they will be the ones to suffer a loss of donations directly?
At least, two of the super delegates called sub caucauses in SD43 and one openly mentioned that he will not be competing to be the elected delegate for that subcaucus because he is already a SD. I wish they should not have done it and kept it neutral - even then, their candidate got only 60% of the support in that district and the only district she won. Regarding 6% (we are talking only one party endorsement here), so should we cancel the outcome of general elections whenever the voter turnout is less than 50% because it is not will of the people (majority choose not to vote/participate)?
We in Ash’s camp need to be prepared for a primary. My fear is that is where this is headed. But, we’ll beat Bonoff then too, and it may just give Ash more exposure for the general. I am very concerned that the buzz is the supers are rallying around Bonoff, and no one is calling on her to withdraw.
Interesting “buzz” you hear…..buzz elsewhere is all Madia. Obviously we listen to different groups. Support is everywhere for Madia.
“So in other words: You won’t allow this to go to a primary where as many of 60% of the people would have a say, but instead you want the decision to be made by 6% of the population who closely identify with a certain party. And then you say Power to the People.”
I don’t get this statement. The reality is that EVERYONE who wanted to participated in the caucus process could. It’s not as if the door in February was open to just 6$ of the population. Indeed, even though turnout at the state caucuses broke almost everyone’s record, almost anyone who wanted to be a delegate for the second round could have been (they at least could be an alternate almost all of whom were sat).
A primary under this system is ridiculous. It’s essentially a do-over election. If the party wants to replace the caucus system with a primary, so be it. I think it would be less fun, but, it would be a primary. But, don’t waste time and money to do an election twice by having multiple caucuses and if a candidate doesn’t like the result, try again.
There were elections in our precinct caucus to be a delegate to Senate District Convention - do these precinct election delegates count? or only super delegates? I heard the same from other precincts because of huge turnout this February.
Once again, my post was taken out of context.
I am NOT saying:
- That pushing this to a Primary would be good for Democrats
- That Madia doesn’t have a lead
- That we should change the system within an election period
I AM saying:
- Claiming that this caucus system represents that “will of the people” - an assertion that several have made - is ridiculous. It represents a small group. And yes, while anyone theoretically could attend, there is a barrier to entry. That barrier is having some loyalty or passion for the DFL party or its principles. It is almost like those wedding receptions you see sometimes that are “open to all”. Sure, it is open to all. But if you don’t know the bride or groom, or you really going to go? And if you do, are you really going to be welcomed?
As a moderate, if I had shown up and said that the DFL would be nuts not to put Hovland up against Paulsen, and oh, by the way, I supported Mitt Romney and I think the Bush tax cuts had merit, would I have really been embraced?
DTM,
Yes, frankly, you would have and you could have been elected a delegate (or just signed up to be one) out of your precinct caucuses, moved up to the senate district convention and subcaucused for Hovland. It truly is an open party and (contrary to some people’s opinions) without litmus tests on belonging. I know many Dems who voted for Reagan and Daddy Bush. I know many Dems in “mixed marriages” - you know a Dem married to a Republican. All are, truly, welcome in the DFL - and welcome to the argument. The difference between the Dem party and the GOP - lots of arguments take place here and we don’t all get along - but we don’t have to. Democracy is messy and noisy.
The caucuses and conventions are representative of those who bothered to show up. For someone to come out now and say they don’t like the result and want to change the result (i.e., “abiding” by the endorsement or not when they have promised openly that they would) is not acceptable. Changing to a primary rather than a caucus is for next cycle. These three candidates said they would abide. Not abiding is not acceptable because it takes money away from our candidates for the race in November as the party would have to pay for a primary election and they’ve already paid for a caucus/convention schedule.
I’M NOT SAYING I DON’T LIKE THE RESULT AND WANT TO CHANGE THE PROCESS. Read my freaking posts, for a 5th time.
Claims were made that the people have spoken in these caucuses, so don’t let this go to a primary. I believe that you actually get a much better idea of the peoples’ wishes in a primary. I think that claim about the people speaking in a caucus that draws 6% of our voting public is oxymoronic.
I’m taking issue with that one statement, not with the result or the process. It is fine to want to end the race and get a certain candidate the early endorsement, but don’t try to make a case that it is somehow the will of the people. It is the will of partisans.
As a Union Man, I refuse to support someone that has taken a position against ones fundamental right to join a labor organization such as Madia has. I refuse to understand why a true Democrat would abandon a viable Democratic candidate for a candidate that is unknown, unproven and untrustworthy.
Madia goes around slamming Bonoff’s voting record on unions, but fails to tell people why he opposed unions in the past. Why is it that nobody has pressed him on this issue? Jigar, why did you oppose unions before and why have you seen the light, or have you?
I refuse to believe that Madia will do the right thing when it comes to the true DFL way. Has he abandoned all of his Republican ways or just some?
All’s I know when I cast my ballot as a super delegate it will be for a true lifelong Democrat Terri Bonoff!
If I have this straight, the person named Jigar who was anti-union is in the past and not supposed to be spoken of.
Today, we have Ashwin, and he says he is pro-union.
Good heavens, people. Get over it. He wrote an article about unions in the university when he was 18. This has been addressed ad nauseum on the blogs several times.
He has asked to be called Ashwin which is the name he goes by (his given middle name). Why is this so objectionable to you, DTM? My hubby goes by his middle name yet went by his first name when he was in college, too. It’s not unheard of. In the military many people choose a name to go by that is different from their childhood name. Many Jews choose different names completely when they move to Israel. Many Muslims choose different names when they convert. Why does this bother you so much? People change their names. It’s legal.
Why not address real issues? Is it because you have none?
If Ashwin Madia is so anti-union then how come he has been endorsed by several so far…..
So once again we revisit Jigar Ashwin Madia’s ancient past. Yes, as an 18 year old college student body president he voted against a union. Union Man, have you really looked into what he did and why? And do you hold the exact same views now that you held when you were 18?! And did you ever do anything that we should know about — as a super delegate you must be an elected official, so where are your skeletons? There are only a couple of men who are super delegates that are not elected to office, and they are neutral at this point.
Ash (yes, I respectfully use the name he goes by now 12 years later-my husband has a nickname too) represented the students, and the faculty union did not want the student’s voice to be recognized in University decisions. As student body president, he was representing the group he was elected to represent. What’s wrong with that?!
As a union family, and as former republicans, we see no problem with that! And as a long time military and now veteran’s family, we support J. Ashwin Madia, United States Marine Veteran, lawyer and candidate for Congress!
As a poor little regular delegate, I will do what my very large caucus elected me to do, which was to vote for J. Ashwin Madia on April 12. As a super delegate, you should consider voting the way the majority of delegates in all of the senate districts have voted, .
Bonoff must be truly desperate to trot out these tired old arguments again, and to slam a person for their name in a way that appears to be recially motivated is sad.
If you are truly a super delegate, you do not deserve to be re-elected.
You also need to improve your grammar.
Instead of trashing a candidate, how about focusing on the issues?
DTM — would you please get off your tired old “not the will of the people” and move on?! You could have gone to your precinct caucus and become a delegate to your SD convention. You could have come to your senate district convention. YOu could have run to become a delegate. You could have gone on to the Cd convention and then the state convention. It’s not that hard! And I would say that 212,000 peop0le state wide, 32,000 people at the 3rd Cd conventions and over 4,000 at my senate dstrict is a pretty loud and representative voice! There were lots of people with lots of ideas!
Just because you did not get involved does not mean that this is not the people speaking. It just means YOU did not participate, and you have no one to blame but yourself.
Union Man,
If you are truly a super-delegate, why hide behind an anonymous login? Surely our superdelegates would be willing to state the basis for their support of Terri in plain view.
I suspect you are not a super-delegate. I won’t accept that you are until you disclose your identity. As a super-delegate, you owe us at least that.
Nor do I see anything in Ashwin’s letter to the editor which shows he was “against ones fundamental right to join a labor organization.” He’s merely urging the faculty to not vote for collective bargaining because he believes such a move would not only hurt students, but, the faculty itself. One can point out the cost-benefit of unionization without disagreeing with the fundamental rights of workers to unionize.
I am married to a teacher and come from a union family. There are plenty of times when those unions act in a manner that can be characterized as disadvantageous to its members — indeed, unions are often guilt of seeking self-preservation over the interests of its workers. Ashwin is merely pointing out the negative impact of collective bargaining within the context of a university setting. Blind adherence to entities we term as democratic, regardless of its activities, is bad for the party. We need to have the strength to say when our friends are wrong just as much as our enemies.
But what he most definitely is NOT doing is saying, “faculty members should be denied their right to unionize.”
DTM - I too take issue with your bashing of “will of the people”.
For starters, this is a republic, not a democracy. So our CD3 Rep
is supposed to be representing the will of about 1/2 million Minnesotans. Whether they do or not is another issue - our enlightened super delegates have seen fit to avoid the will of the people on a number of issues including stadiums, but our government works that way throughout. I personally would prefer pure democracy, but it is not a realistic way to run a country.
Going to a primary system presents its own set of problems. Open or closed? If it’s open, you could have the Republicans deciding our candidates. If it’s closed, much depends upon what races are on the ballot. Turnout can be very inconsistant and if small, a special interest group voting on dog catcher could have unwarranted influence on other races (even in the general election, how many times have you pulled the lever for someone in some race you knew nothing about?).
I had 116 people show up at my precinct caucus. Of that number, less than 40 stayed beyond the Presidential ballot. From that number we could have 32 delegates elected. We ended up with 28 and only that many because I had every member of my family sign absentee forms to become delegates. So people have the opportunity.
My own story briefly: After 2004, I was so fed up with the Democrats and Kerry that I was never going to bother to vote again.
But I decided I should try to be proactive instead. So now I find myself going to Rochester. I didn’t elect myself, I didn’t really even want to run as a delegate, but I wanted our subcaucus to be represented by someone who supports what we were caucusing for and nobody else who was running did. Everyone has that opportunity. I am not a party insider, have no special connections or vested interests. Just someone who is choosing people I like and then trying to go to bat for them. And I feel I was selected by the will of the people. The fact that it may be 6% of 6% has no bearing on it because, as in November, everyone has the opportunity to participate and it is supposed to be representative government.
And I’m going to represent my subcaucus.
Union Man comes from a proud tradition of inept Bonoff supporters, such as “Objective Observer” and “dembones,” who pretend to care deeply about some issue in order to launch an attack against Madia, but who just end up with egg on their faces because they can’t keep their stories straight.
E.g., Union Man, if you’re going to pretend to be a male superdelegate who’s a member of a union, at least do your homework to learn whether in fact there are any male superdelegates committed to Bonoff who are union members. Duh. Whichever staffer you are, the Bonoff campaign should cut off your paycheck for sheer incompetence.
As for “Dembones,” Madia has gone out of his way to make clear that he was not a combat veteran. He states clearly on his website that “he served as a prosecutor, defense counsel, and legal advisor to a Marine Corps commander. Madia was lead attorney in over one hundred trials, including thirteen jury trials.” http://www.madiaforcongress.com/bio.htm
The DFL can only win with an endorsed candidate. Madia is the only candidate who can win the endorsement. Team Bonoff: join the winning DFL team and let’s go beat Paulsen. Stop with the hair-brained attacks already. You’re just making your candidate look more pathetic than she already looked.
I stand by my comments regarding the caucus system not being “the will of the people”. You all made the claim that it was, and I simply refuted it.
When you are actively trying to prevent two or three candidates from being elected via a primary election, something smells wrong. You want to keep the selection process within a smaller partisan group rather than the public forum. It might be the way the game is played, but I take issue that it is “the people” speaking.
I’m not saying to change the system. I’m just saying call it was it is — the partisans’ candidate. Not the will of the people.
Marc,
You still believe this will go to a primary?
As for my “Jigar” and “Ashwin” comment, I was simply clarifying for Union Man. He seems new on this board, so I was taking a moment to bring him up to speed that the “Jigar” days are not to be revisited, per stern instruction to others on earlier threads.
And for the record, this is nothing personal. I have deep respect for Madia’s service to our country and his obvious strong work ethic as evidenced by his campaign success.
DTM, I do believe “stern instruction” should be reworded to “respect shown for one’s chosen name”. I show the same respect when I call someone “William” or “Will” rather than “Willy” or Susan rather than Susie or Mousie or whatever nickname one had growing up.
I am so sick of the juvenile behavior of the Bonoff supporters. One would think that no one had ever heard of choosing a name to be called by before! Well, “Danny” or should we call you “Danny boy”? Or were you maybe “Richie” or “Bobby” in your younger days and chose to be “Dan the Man” rather than “Danny boy”?
It’s simple respect.
My point was less about the name, more about the beliefs. If the statute of limitations on one’s beliefs is ~ 7 years, then I expect you to change your accusations of publics servants like Norm Coleman and Erik Paulsen.
I don’t want to get hung up on the name thing, but Jigar is a proper first name, not a nickname. Furthermore, it was a name he went by publicly, in print and as a campus leader no less. Comparing “Jigar” to “Danny Boy” may very well be offensive to Madia.
And many on these boards have, in fact, been instructed to use “Ashwin” instead of “Jigar”, and I was simply bringing Union Guy up to speed.
DTM - I have no problem with the Jigar/Ashwin comment.
What I find ironic is that people want to bash him for being
ex-GOP, yet claim Bonoff can win Nov. because she’s more GOP
than he to “the people”. Bonoff’s positions would probably be
a very good fit to try to make CD3 blue, but at this point, I
think my biggest issue with her is that this woman was handed
this nomination by the party - up about 20 to zip before it
even started. Now she’s down about 20. I equate that to the
Gophers blowing a 4 touchdown lead in the 4th quarter. Either
she’s really bad, he’s really good, or both.
At this point, her only hail mary is a primary. And if you think
that will bring a different “will of the people” go for it, but
I personally think nothing will change except spending $$ that should be used on Paulsen and bloodying up both of them and perhaps
to the point that her Senate seat could go back red in 2010 and
cost Madia in ‘08. Let the Republican’s throw trash at us, not each other. The Madia people ain’t gonna switch on 4/12, but I
have spoken to a couple of Bonoff people that were having some second thoughts after hearing Madia speak on 3/15 - not to say they
would change, but they were impressed with him. I personally thought Bonoff’s mother was more impressive than she and I’d vote for her in a heartbeat.
Whatever. I read an interview with Ash when he related that his mother called him Jiggie. When entering the US Marines he might have been very well aware that nicknames are very common and, not wanting Jiggie to be his nickname, have chosen to use Ashwin as it could more easily be shortened to Ash.
I don’t think it matters whether someone calls him Jigar Ashwin Madia or J. Ashwin Madia as he signs himself. I don’t think he cares, frankly. I would suggest he be referred to as J. Ashwin Madia or Ashwin Madia as those are how he refers to himself.
Statute of limitations on Paulsen and Coleman are not necessary….I’ve been in SD42 for 24 years and have many years of Paulsen to refer to when discussing his foibles. Coleman’s more recent foibles are more of interest to me than anything he wrote 7-10 years ago, frankly. There’s enough there upon which to base an opinion. I don’t need to go digging. I just need to read the paper daily.
Fair enough.
Most Chinese Americans have a) Chinese name (ex. XieWen )and b) An American Name (Janet). So do Mexican Americans (Enrique/Ricky), Italian Americans of old (Salvatore/Sal).
On one hand we ask people to assimilate. On the other hand we are accusing of nefariousness because they change their name. What gives.
What gives is that many Minnesotans know Madia by the name Jigar from his very visible time at the U. Now he is going by Ashwin. So we call him Ashwin.
No big deal.
“Many” Minnesotans? I’d question that. How many things did you write 12 years ago that are memorable today? I honestly have to admit that things I wrote when I was 18 were not memorable (or relevant) when I was 30. I also didn’t go by the same name at 18 as I did at 30 either, though.
It’s no big deal. He’s made no secret of his name nor of his writings. For some reason a group of people here seem to think there is something suspicious about both and keep insinuating so. It’s just strange to me….and to others, apparently.
The reality is that we live in a purple district that is trending blue. It will take a moderate candidate to win in November, especially if Paulsen pulls the “I am a moderate” garbage.
A lifelong true blue democrat, as Terri and her supporters constantly tell us, will have great difficulty winning.
Any candidate perceived by the voters to be “establishment picked” will have trouble getting elected.
We in SD42 have lived with Paulsen for the last 12 years, in fact I remember him door knocking when he ran the first time at the young age of 24. Who better to know what it will take to send him packing than his constituents?
I know the Bonoff supporters keep reminding us that she won in a red district, but the fact is she had lots of help and money from outside of the district, and in the 2nd election she lost percentage points to the same opponent when she should have improved those numbers. Now that she has to build her own campaign from inside of her district, she has shown that her grassroots organizing leaves much to be desired.
Ashwin Madia is not being picked by a few insiders. He has won decisively in 10 senate districts, tied in 1, and took many more delegates than the Bonoff people expected in her own backyard. He has done this with a flawlessly run campaign, open campaigning and communication and lots of grassroots organizing. Every event has lots of new people coming out to volunteer for Ash!
He is a wonderful candidate,and will be a wonderful congressman. Instea of contnuing to bicker, we should all be getting behind Ash and working towards the endorsement and then the general election.
Our opponent is Erik Paulsen, not each other!
Any Bonoff supporters who still believe she can block this endorsement and take it to a primary? Or have they conceded?
March 17, 2008
Bonoff Leads In Own Poll
Minnesota State Senator Terri Bonoff leads her closest rival by four points, a survey for her campaign shows, suggesting that Democrats have a strong chance to pick off a seat held by retiring Republican Jim Ramstad. The survey suggests the state’s Third District, which surrounds Minneapolis on three sides, could be one of the closest contests of the year.
Conducted by Democratic firm Greenberg Quinlan Rosner Research, the poll was taken 3/11-12 and surveyed 401 likely voters. The margin of error is /- 4.9%. Bonoff, Democratic attorney Ashwin Madia and Republican opponent Erik Paulsen, a state representative, were surveyed.
General Election Matchup
Bonoff 44
Paulsen 40
Paulsen 43
Madia 40
Bonoff, the candidate of choice for Washington Democrats, purportedly leads Madia in a primary ballot test, though those numbers were not released. Bonoff had raised just over $300,000 at the end of December, with $230,000 left in the bank, compared with $166,000 raised and $124,000 in the bank for Madia. Paulsen, who has a clear shot at the GOP nod, has raised nearly $390,000 with $363,000 left in reserve.
Democrats competing in the Third District has to be a serious blow to GOP psyches in Minnesota, but it’s a story that is being repeated around the country. The suburban district, which includes the Mall of America and Lake Minnetonka (after which Tonka toys are named), has been trending more Democratic of late after a century of being prime Republican territory. President Bush never took a victory larger than five points — he beat John Kerry in the seat by just three.
Still, Bonoff’s lead is not overwhelming, and her race won’t be easy. Eager to increase gains made in the North Star State in 2006, when the party held a Senate seat and picked up a congressional seat, D.C. Democrats are likely to make Bonoff’s victory a top priority and could spend heavily to do so. Paulsen, by all accounts a good candidate, will not be an easy foe to beat, especially in an area where many still reflexively reach for the GOP lever.
LGR - Thanks for the MOE on Bonoff’s numbers. Where did you get that stuff?
DTM - More people were involved in the caucus process than read the
MN Daily.
In the military the most frequent nickname given to a person is some
take-off on one’s last name as that is displayed above the breast pocket on one’s uniform. Madman a likely possibility. Bonoff would
probable become something R rated, good thing she never served.
Let’s move on.
Gavin Sullivan has commentary about the endorsement process - http://www.gavinsullivan.com/
Never trust a poll writeup when provided by a campaign that doesn’t have full disclosure. It’s useless. Could be very important but we’ll never know unless we know the sample size, the wording of the questions and the margin of error.
If it is true it’s exceptionally exciting for Ash Madia and rather sad for Terri and Erik, quite frankly. It basically is saying that an unknown US Marine attorney is within a few percentage points of a known sitting state senator and a known sitting state representative. Says the public is open, interested and willing to consider everyone. Very encouraging for Ashwin Madia.
Let’s Get Real,
Where did that posting come from? Is that a press release from Bonoff? Is she so delusional that she actually believes she’s still the presumptive nominee? And, if she’s leading the primary polling, why wouldn’t she release that information?
Oh, I reread (after coffee) and found the info. It’s nothing new. It’s the same poll released last week from her campaign. Same 401 sample size (out of 32k attending caucuses) with margin of error of 4.9ºsically speaking same analysis as last week - Terri thinks she’s winning when in reality all of the results are within the margin of error and the poll tells us something very different. What the poll says is that a sitting state senator, a sitting state representative and an unknown US Marine attorney are all tied for the office. With that information, this is bad news for Terri and Erik and excellent news for Ash. The unknown is tied with them and they are the “known” entities in the race. The more people meet and hear Ash the more they support him. I say, thanks Terri for paying for this and for putting it out. Your spin notwithstanding, it’s great news for Ash and bad news for Terri and Erik.
“Greenberg, Quinlan, Rosner Research designed and administered this telephone survey conducted by professional interviewers. The survey reached 401 adults in Minnesota, 18 years or older, who indicated they were registered to vote, that they voted or were ineligible to vote in the 2004 Presidential Election, that they are almost certain to or would probably vote in the 2008 Presidential Election. The survey was conducted March 11-12, 2008. Respondents were randomly selected from a list of registered voters. The sample was stratified by town. Quotas were assigned to reflect the expected contribution of these areas to the total vote in the general election.” from Bonoff’s website
Interesting that “quotas were assigned …”. That indicates to me
they may not have counted everyone in their own poll.
This article may be 12 years old, but it tells the integrity of this so called new Democrat. Terri Bonoff has a good voting record she can stand by, and Jigar has a record he must run from. I’d change my name too if I was trying to convince DFL’rs that I was a Democrat now. Remember, a cheetah can’t change its spots!
Bottom line, his speeches are just rhetoric that he has been schooled on. They are just the regular issues that are no surprise to Democrats ie…war, gays, trade. Has he always carried these values, or has he just changed in order to proclaim that he is now a Democrat? I think he probably looked at the possibility of running for Congress, and then realized that all indications were that Democrats were winning handedly. So hey, running as a Republican won’t work, so become a Democrat, fool all of these Democrats that I’ve seen the light and get elected into office.
DON’T BE FOOLED! HE’S NOT A DEMOCRAT!!!
Look, I’m trying to keep this simple for many of you. As a long time Democrat, I’m offended that someone can tell us we are all wrong, then come to our side and say we are right after all. Why don’t we let Jigar show us that he is really a Democrat by electing him into some local office so he can prove himself? Congress is a very important position to send a kid like this for a test drive.
Read his article below…….and by the way, I’m not a staffer for Bonoff!
Dole would bring integrity, leadership to highest office
By By Jigar
Bob Dole has always been a soldier, from his trying World War II days to his dedicated years on Capitol Hill. This old soldier has come back for a battle on behalf of his country, and is deserving of the opportunity to do what he does best — serve the United States. Dole is the man who will fight on behalf of our generation, our communities and our nation.
By 2013, Social Security will be broke, in desperate need of money to pay debts. This will be the same period in which our generation will be firmly entrenched in the work force. Income taxes will need to be raised or government spending will need to be slashed in a draconian manner in order for the United States to remain financially solvent. The effect on our generation will be devastating. Currently, Medicare is growing at a rate of 11 percent a year, and will surpass Social Security in the year 2000 as the largest government program. That will have back-breaking consequences for our generation. The time has come for our generation to unite, cast aside our political affiliations and vote on behalf of the interests of our generation.
The obvious question now arises — which candidate better represents the interests of our generation? Ironically, the man who is 50 years older than most college students, Bob Dole, will serve our generation’s interests far better than the incumbent. President Clinton demonstrated his callous position toward our generation in May 1995 when Congress proposed, as a bold measure on behalf of our generation, to slow the growth rate of Medicare by 4 percent. Clinton, recognizing the political volatility and opportunity for political exploitation involved in addressing so touchy an issue, resorted to demagoguery, scared the elderly and forced Congress to withdraw the proposal. Clinton knows better than anyone else that entitlements need reform, yet when the time came for a strong stance, he chose to play politics rather than take a stand on behalf of our generation. Clearly, Clinton does not represent our generation’s interests.
Dole supports reform, and will be forced, regardless of his position, to reform entitlements, which will support our generation. The reason is simple — if Dole is elected, it will be primarily on the basis of his proposed 15 percent tax cut, and consequently this cut must be priority number one for Dole. This cut cannot be made without entitlement reform. Entitlement reform is inevitable under a Dole administration — excellent for our generation.
Although Dole is better for our generation, the president must also be better for our communities. Our communities are plagued with crime, evidenced by urban decay as well as societal breakdown. Dole has a two-planked position regarding crime — prevention and enforcement.
Primarily, Dole advocates a policy of prevention, stressing educational reform as the major means to keep youngsters out of trouble. Real educational reform is only possible with political courage, for the single biggest impediment to educational reform in this nation is a political powerhouse, the National Education Association. The NEA is a powerful teachers union known for opposing such reforms as performance-based pay as well as state and national testing standards. Jaime Escalante, the award-winning Calculus teacher whose story inspired the movie “Stand and Deliver,” said, “Unions are more interested in politics than kids.” President Clinton’s hands are tied on this issue, as the Democratic National Committee has accepted more than $3.5 million from the NEA since 1993. In fact, Clinton, under pressure from the NEA, actually reversed positions on a reform bill that would have allowed poor children in the District of Columbia to receive grants to attend better schools.
Despite the dilapidated state of education, the NEA and Clinton continue to preserve the status quo. Dole has stated numerous times that he will take on the NEA, advancing the cause of education in our communities, as well as reinforcing the message that, at the presidential level, the good of communities and the nation should not come before political gain.
The second plank in Dole’s position revolves around law enforcement. Dole has proposed a revitalized war on drugs, complete with a task force linking the defense department, CIA and Drug Enforcement Agency to beef up the interdiction of illegal drug shipments in the United States. Clinton’s record on drugs is clear and disturbing. He slashed the drug czar’s office by 50 percent; not surprisingly, drug use among teens doubled during his term. The task of real leadership on the part of Clinton in the war on drugs stands in sharp contrast to Dole’s strong commitment to our communities.
Finally, after addressing concerns regarding our generation as well as our communities, it is time to address an issue facing our nation as a whole: presidential character. The presidency of the Unites States is the highest office in the world, different from all other U.S. positions in that the president serves as a national figurehead, a spokesman for the entire country. Therefore, fairly or unfairly, the president is responsible for upholding the dignity and respect of the office. Dole, who served so valiantly in World War II, who rose above tremendous odds to conquer his debilitating injury, who devoted his entire life to national service, is a man of whom the entire nation can be proud. The nation can look to him for leadership and guidance, without fear of being dragged down by weekly scandals. Bob Dole will restore honor to the office of president.
Dole is a man committed to the betterment of our generation, our communities and our nation. He has stood tall on behalf of his country his entire life, never compromising his integrity or the nation’s well-being for political gain. If given the honor of serving his nation one last time, Dole will continue to do what he has done his entire life — make us proud.
Jigar Madia, a sophomore studyingbiology and business, is Minnesota Student Association Speaker of the Forum.
“Real educational reform is only possible with political courage, for the single biggest impediment to educational reform in this nation is a political powerhouse, the National Education Association. The NEA is a powerful teachers union known for opposing such reforms as performance-based pay as well as state and national testing standards”.
Wrtten by: Jigar
Jigar Madia, a sophomore studying biology and business, is Minnesota Student Association Speaker of the Forum.
NEA and its affiliates have been leaders in the fight to improve public schools — and oppose alternatives that divert attention, energy, and resources from efforts to reduce class size, enhance teacher quality, and provide every student with books, computers, and safe and orderly schools.
Courtesy of NEA website:
So…..how do feel about this Jigar? Do you support this agenda or Bob Dole’s?
Jigar as a military leader……NOT!
Jigar how many times did you leave the “green zone”?….0
Did you ever see combat? NO!
Veterans should be appalled that this guy is actually wearing his combat fatigues like he actually saw combat. The truth is that he was a JAG and he never saw combat Why don’t you wear your dress suit instead?
Lets see….a phony Democrat, and now a phony war hero!
Jigar you should be ashamed of yourself……
DON’T BE FOOLED! HE’S NOT A DEMOCRAT OR A WAR HERO!
Union Man — I don’t think that Ash has ever said that he was a war hero.
And finally, do you think that running new converts to our party out, is a good way to get new converts to the DFL? Sean
Also, I can’t stress this enough — do not post entire articles or op-eds. They are the property of the publication that published them in the first place. To reproduce them in their entirety is a violation of law, and also just poor form. If you do it again I’ll delete the comment that contains the article. Sean
The name thing: his own website refers to him as “Jigar Ashwin Madia,” so he’s certainly not running away from his past. http://www.madiaforcongress.com/bio.htm
The fact that he used to be a Republican is old news. DFL convention-goers considered it, and then handed him wins in 10 of 12 DFL Senate District Conventions.
As for your conspiracy theory that he had a secret plan to get elected as a Democrat, he volunteered for DFLers Wendy Wilde and Sen. Satveer Chaudhary in 2006, long before Rep. Ramstad retired.
Madia has explained time and again that he became a Democrat because the Republican party forgot about civil liberties, fiscal responsibility, responsible energy policy, wise use of military power, and pragmatic problem-solving, among other issues.
Bonoff’s camp is trying to have it both ways: by dredging up 11-year-old writings, they’re trying to say that he’s not liberal enough; but in her (failing) efforts to poach Madia’s pledged delegates, Bonoff says that Madia isn’t conservative enough to gain support from Republicans and Independents.
So which is it, Sen. Bonoff? Is he too conservative, or too liberal? He can’t be both.
The truth is, she has no intellectually consistent argument for why she should beat him. She just wants to beat him. That’s been her problem from the start: there’s no coherent rationale for why she should win.
Face it, Team Bonoff: it’s over. You lost. Now get in line with the party and let’s beat Paulsen.
Union Man is the one who should be ashamed of himself. I’d be embarrassing if I was as closed minded and small minded as him. Get over yourself. You obviously have been paid well to spout the line for Bonoff. It’s a shame you have no idea what you’re talking about with veterans and with Madia’s positions on issues. When did you serve? Did you serve in a war zone? Let’s dissect your service, why don’t we? I did serve. Ashwin Madia is a veteran which is what he has claimed to be. If you know so much you’d know that in the military you don’t choose your fatigues. The military chooses them for you. Anyone serving in a war zone (and that is what Iraq is) wears fatigues. Period. Don’t be ignorant as well as an ass.
Union Man,
So I take it you no longer are holding on to the delusion that you are a super-delegate? Or, Wellstone Forever, did you just forget to change your login again once you yourself again were exposed as a phony?
For all of you wanting to know about Bonoff’s plans, I received a letter and DVD today. The letter indicates merely “we will work everyday until the convention”. No indication beyond that. I consider the DVD fluff. I’m going to write and ask for detailed positions, similarities/differences with Madia’s, why she thinks her
positions are better, and why she thinks thinks she would do better in November than she did now (blow a 4 touchdown lead).
We’re up to about 200 posts here now. Everything Union Man says
has been dealt with before. It’s not worth the effort. Bring something new to the table.
Look, it’s not about being close-minded or an ass. It is plain and simple to me. Why trust this guy? Give him an opportunity to prove himself not with words but with action. Have him run for another position that he would have the ability to prove that he indeed is a true Democrat, what is wrong with that?
As far as being a war hero, he touts his wartime as an important aspect of why he should be supported. All I’m saying is that I was very disappointed to find out that he never saw combat. Can cooks working for sub-contracted companies claim the same thing? Bottom line he was a JAG. A hired attorney for the military is all he was.
Look, I have my right to my opinion. You may not agree with it, but it is still my opinion. Mind you, the majority of the other super delegates agree too. It comes down to the simple fact that he’s not a proven leader to send to Washington. They will eat him up alive in the beltway and spit him out. We need an experienced hand in to represent us in the 3rd CD. My belief is that Terri is that person.
“the other super delegates agree too.”
“You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.”
Now you’re trying to back-peddle from the trash you were spewing.
Madia is the first to jump up and shout to the rafters that he never saw combat. He has stated that he has such respect for his fellow Marines who did see combat that he would never try to misrepresent his service.
Plenty of people who want to see him succeed have suggested that he play up the military angle more, and he doesn’t follow their advice because the last thing he wants to do is overstate his military experiences. On his website, in his speeches, anywhere he can, he makes it clear that he served in the Marine Corps by representing Marines as their attorney, and by working with Iraqis to build their justice system.
Union Man, or should I say, Wellstone in My Heart Forever, quit it already. Bonoff already looks pathetic enough without her supporters going after Madia’s military service.
If you know anything at all about military service you’d know that all military are trained to serve in war zones under fire. Whether or not they do serve under fire is irrelevant. Service to our country is that. It is putting yourself on the line, going where asked and doing what is asked. If you would go to Madia’s webpage you would find that he enlisted in the US Marines (not known for being wussies), trained at Quantico Marine Corp Base and was deployed to Okinawa and Baghdad. That’s what he said he did. He served in the capacity asked - as a JAG attorney (i.e., using his expertise) to defend marines accused of crimes such as the offense of being gay in the military as well as serving to assist multi-national organizations in building the legal system in Iraq. That is admirable. The last time I checked the green zone in Iraq wasn’t exactly Central Park. People are killed there, too. It wouldn’t matter to me whether or not he served in a war zone or not. It’s the service to our country that matters. By your implication all of the servicemen and women who served between wars and in peacetime service are less than those who served under fire. You’re totally wrong. Service is service. Some face more difficulties but doing what you are asked honorably is service.
Terri can’t even win in a race among her base against other Dems. Please, enlighten us how you think she can win in the genereal election. She’s a flawed very liberal candidate in a purple district. Madia (and Hovland before him) were the only chances the DFL has this fall. She’s the only one who couldn’t have won this seat at all.
He is a leader. Proven in the military justice system. You can’t ask for more. From one veteran about another. It is definitely service and it is leadership.
In fairness, unless WIMHF was cagey enough to go use an wholly separate computer (which, if they did, would be more sad than anything) Union Man is not WIMHF. Sean
“Wellstone in My Heart Forever”…..that’s the problem with some of you that claim to be Democrat. Now you are bashing me because I believed in Paul Wellstone. Wow, if you are a true Democrat you should retract your bashing immediately. No true Dem would slam someone that has a part set aside for Paul Wellstone and the courageous things he did.
If you don’t retract, you and Jigar are one of a kind. NOT TRUE DEMOCRATS!
“Can cooks working for sub-contracted companies claim the same thing? Bottom line he was a JAG. A hired attorney for the military is all he was.”
He’s not a cook or does he work as a contractor. He’s a Marine. A Marine is a Marine.
“Give him an opportunity to prove himself not with words but with action. Have him run for another position that he would have the ability to prove that he indeed is a true Democrat, what is wrong with that?”
What other office would you suggest he run for? His experience, the issues he believes in, his past service have all related to issues of FEDERAL importance. He’s not doing this to be a career politician, taking his turn to go from one level of government to the next so that eventually he can climb the ranks
He knows and cares about issues of Federal concern. His experience in Iraq, his beliefs on civil liberties, his concerns over veterans are not issues of importance at the state level. Congress is where he belongs.
If your only concern is that he do something for the DFL, why isn’t his work on past DFL campaigns not enough for you?
Wow. I’m offended on behalf of all veterans everywhere. A US Marine is the toughest of the tough. The other services (I was US Army) are, honestly, one level below. No veteran should be disparaged as you have disparaged veterans. Frankly, I read Terri’s responses to the DFL Veterans Caucus questions and I think she would be appalled by your comments. She has respect for our veterans and her campaign has also stated they have respect for Ash Madia’s service to our country. Maybe you should check with them for your talking points before disparaging veterans again. It’s definitely not going to work in her favor for you to be out making these comments.
FYI….contractors are not veterans due to their work as contractors. Many contractors are veterans, though, having chosen to return to active situations for private contractors.
“All I’m saying is that I was very disappointed to find out that he never saw combat. Can cooks working for sub-contracted companies claim the same thing? Bottom line he was a JAG. A hired attorney for the military is all he was. “
He was in Iraq. The whole (cheney)in’ COUNTRY is a war zone.
And you know little about the Marines.
I love the “hired” attorney for the Marines comment personally. Shows the heighth of ignorance on many levels….1) Iraq - i.e., Bush’s war zone (as if any place there is “safe”), 2) the US Marines, 3) military service and honor, 4) insults to military duty.
I think someone should send Union Man’s comments over to Terri Bonoff for her comments. I do believe she would be exceptionally apologetic and embarrassed. Whether or not I agree with Terri on many issues, she does understand and respect military service to our country.
Apparently Union Man doesn’t.
Union Man - You are entitled to your opinions and this should be a good place to express them. I personally think his experience as a lawyer is of much more value to this campaign than if he were breaking down doors. But his lack of experience is a valid point.
I too have some concerns about that. I think about 100 posts ago
I said something to the effect of what idiot would run as a liberal democrat in what has traditionally been a red district, especially if they really are still red inside.
From my interactions with Madia, I believe what he is most passionate about is the current abuses of civil rights, both foreign and domestic. I believe that is where his energies will go if he goes to D.C.. That is very important to me too and I think
he is best suited for that and will probably fall in line on most other things, at least until he gets his feet on the ground.
Finally, I’m fairly new to this blog, but it’s fun. I do want to remain civil, even if I disagree with people. And I enjoy the disagreements, because they can cause me to think about things I may otherwise overlook. And gotcha’s can be great fun. I know people can become very fervent for their positions and I applaud that, but I hope we can be respectful for everyone and save our wrath for the GOP.
Union Man - I seem to recall you saying something about being a delegate. If so you may be at the meeting in Minnetonka tonight.
If you’re there and want to talk, I’ll wear my VSM.
From Bonoff’s press release today:
“I am the one candidate in this race that has committed to leaving no permanent military bases in Iraq. We must leave a requisite force to guard our embassy, but any further presence will only signal to the world that again we are disingenuous in our intentions. We must signal to the region that it’s time to turn our focus in Iraq to rebuilding.”
I don’t get this statement. Isn’t the stated purpose of the military in Iraq to assist in rebuilding, both in terms of infrastructure and politically. How does Terri plan on undertaking a new focus on rebuilding with little to no presence in Iraq? An embassy certainly can’t be in the business of rebuilding a country’s infrastructure.
It’s not that he’s a Marine that I’m concerned with. I admire all Marines and all US military. What I don’t like is that he touts his experience in Iraq as a reason to vote for him. I beg to differ with his reasoning. What does he have to prove that what he says about his experience is true? I would like to see it.
I am not a surrogate for the Bonoff campaign, so if someone reaches out to her that is just fine. What I am is a concerned Democrat that sees other Democrats getting burned.
Union Man:
““Wellstone in My Heart Foreverâ€â€¦..that’s the problem with some of you that claim to be Democrat. Now you are bashing me because I believed in Paul Wellstone. Wow, if you are a true Democrat you should retract your bashing immediately. No true Dem would slam someone that has a part set aside for Paul Wellstone and the courageous things he did.
If you don’t retract, you and Jigar are one of a kind. NOT TRUE DEMOCRATS!”
Does this mean that you are, in fact, Wellstone in my Heart Forever merely using a new userID? Not only that, claiming to be a super delegate?
No one has ever bashed you because you believe in Wellstone. People have gone after your association of some of your ideas with the likes of Wellstone.
“I beg to differ with his reasoning.”
Then explain your difference in reasoning! So far you’ve just said that you differ.
Madia’s claim is that because he worked in Iraq with Iraqi officials to build that country’s legal system, he has personal insight into what it will take to create a political solution to Iraq’s problems. Makes sense to me.
If you want to see proof of what he did over there, I bet you could call his campaign office and ask to see some kind of documentation. I imagine he would be happy to prove his service to you.
Prove it that he has done what he has said…..otherwise it’s just campaign B.S.
“Prove it that he has done what he has said…..otherwise it’s just campaign B.S.”
This is absurd. What, do you think he took those pictures at Glamour Shots?
Prove that Bonoff:
- Has executive experience
- Was instrumental in passing the Transportation Bill
- Really has a son
- Was a democrat for life
- Was the president of the Babe Ruth Baseball League
These are equally absurd requests.
Military experience is military experience, plain and simple. You either served or you didn’t. When you signed up to serve, you had no assurances that you were going to be safe. Its not like you can pick and choose your assignments.
I have to side with the Madia backers on that one.
Asking for more information on his exact role in something he touts, however, is fair. An example would be the Don’t Ask Don’t Tell case. If he is going to make it one of his qualifications, then the voting public has every right to understand the exact role he played and circumstances around it.
Same goes for Bonoff and Paulsen, and any questions people would have about their listed achievements.
Hey Union Man:
The military has changed the age for recruits, so you don’t have to be ‘disappointed he didn’t see combat’ by signing up and going yourself.
It’s quite easy to ‘qualify,’ even if you’re already an almost old guy.
I wasn’t a ‘hired lawyer’ when I served in a combat zone, and I wore pantyhose some days and never carried a weapon, so you’re probably disappointed in my service too.
I guess you want all us military veterans to have combat experience.
Well, even lacking a combat experience, a military veteran that has served in Iraq can read and understand a National Intelligence Estimate without needing someone to interpret it for them.
Why does Terri Bonoff have someone on her staff with a title of ‘National Security Advisor?’
I’d be most interested in hearing details on: “While stationed in Baghdad, he worked with U.S. military and civilian officials, European Union and United Nations representatives, and Iraqi judicial officers to strengthen the Iraqi criminal justice system. He also briefed top U.S. generals on the status of the rule of law in the country.” Madia website.
If that’s as good as it sounds, could be a great assest. As a
young captain, I suspect it may be inflated. But even so, that’s
far more experience than Bonoff has in that area. Also, it’ll play very well in November. If I were to rate issues, I say 1)economy,
2)war, 3) health care. 2 is clearly a Madia plus over both. 3 will end up being nobody’s “plan” but some mass compromise to appease a zillion lobbyists, and however many Republicans and Republican Lites it’ll take to get something passed through the Senate (given we have a Democrat president). So that’ll end up a choice between either Democrat and Paulsen. 1. Again, first term Congressperson will end up the party line, so choice ends up Democrat - Republican.
Any one of them will be one first term congressperson out of 435.
So for me, it’s who do I think can go in there and make the biggest impact and who will fight the hardest to restore civil rights and fight against corporate America running this country. Certainly not Paulsen. Bonoff strikes me as already being aligned with corporate America (Bush Tax Cuts). And as I said earlier, Madia’s passion is the restoration of civil rights.
Bottom line show me the facts that he in fact played a major role in Iraq as he claims to of had. I want to see the proof of the cases that he led the charge in. How and who can verify his claims? The burden of proof is on him, otherwise like I said its campaign BS!
There is proof in what he has written in the past. Maybe you guys have already hashed some of this out on previous posts, but for me and many Democrats it’s too new to ignore.
I look at some of the information that I have read about how he supported Dole over Clinton, took a stance against union organizing and spoke out against the NEA. I’m sorry, but for me and many other Democrats that are familiar with the beltway system, as Rickie Ricardo would say, you’ve got some explaining to do.
The fact is that unions are the base for the Democratic party, like it or not. Without unions, the DFL and candidates would be hard pressed to get elected without our money and our voting base. All Democrats must understand that as unions grow, so does their ability to get elected. So, Jagir or Ashwin or whatever name he goes by now is a true Democrat he would retract what he has written in the past as wrong. I’ve yet to see that written anywhere in his material or speeches. He has talked about some Republican issues that he feels that the Republicans have left him short on, but not on the issues he had written about. Why, may I ask?
UM - “Bottom line show me the facts that he in fact played a major role in Iraq as he claims to of had. I want to see the proof of the cases that he led the charge in. How and who can verify his claims? The burden of proof is on him, otherwise like I said its campaign BS!”
Firstly UM, he described his job. He did not claim he was the top laywer in Baghdad. He did not claim he was the Douglas McAurther of Baghdad. Don’t make stuff up.
Have u any proof that you contacted the Marine Corp JAG. Can you prove that u made any effort in that regard. Absolutely not. You are just another of Bonoffs campagin folks with their n’th trolling identity trying a last minute “kitchen sink”.
On the other hand can you provide any documentation for Terri Bonoffs “executive business experience”. Absolutely not. What is my proof. Her own ex-husband on this blog admitted she joined as a PR gal at Navarre Corp not some high powered executive.
At some point u have to realize your candidate behaves like a 4th grader not picked for a school play
dmc -
thoughtful analysis. I think Paulsen will campaign very well on the economy. That is probably his forte.
“There is proof in what he has written in the past. Maybe you guys have already hashed some of this out on previous posts, but for me and many Democrats it’s too new to ignore.”
Let’s at least not insult everyone’s intelligence on the board. Not only was your username the one that posted many of those previous posts, but, you’ve yet to explain your slip-ups which indicate you are Wellstone Forever, who, also posted repeatedly these same topics. It has been discussed over and over on the board.
“Bottom line show me the facts that he in fact played a major role in Iraq as he claims to of had. I want to see the proof of the cases that he led the charge in. How and who can verify his claims? The burden of proof is on him, otherwise like I said its campaign BS!”
Have you ONCE asked him or his campaign to provide additional details? NO different than every other candidate, he can’t go into excruciating detail on every bit of past experience he has and every possible nuance of his policy positions. If you expect him to, then you should be yelling from the rafters that Terri Bonoff should be talking about everything she did at Tonka toys that qualifies her for the term “executive experience.” She should be telling us every republican she convinced to vote on the transportation bill, how she did it, what she told them, what outfit she was wearing, and why she was wearing it when she did it.
I don’t get any sense that he’s hiding anything. He’s been very frank and detail oriented in the events I’ve heard him field voter questions.
You can’t claim one candidate’s experience is B.S. because you don’t have all of YOUR questions answers, especially when YOU haven’t asked them but on a blog.
Can’t any American file a Freedom of Information Act (FOIA) Request for information from government records?
The United States Marine Corps would have a record of the Administrative Board proceedings in which Captain J. Ashwin Madia represented a Marine accused of homosexuality.
But of course in order to do that, you have to submit the paperwork, and you have to wait for the request to be filled. I suspect Union Man would just rather bitch and moan about Madia needing to prove his claims on a blog than actually doing the homework necessary to obtain the documents that would support or deny the Marine veteran’s statements.
The wait could be long because the government would need to remove the personal data, name, SSN, other identifying details of the Marine, before releasing the data.
In this Age of Transparency, surely it’s easy to obtain the request form needed to file a FOIA request.
Oh yeah, you have to pay a fee also, for reproduction and the research the govt needs to do to fill the request.
With five clicks and a Google search, I found this link:
http://hqinet001.hqmc.usmc.mil/FOIA/index.htm
So there you go, Union Man. I’ve led you to the trough.
Now stick your snout in it and drink. Show us your bark is connected to a curious mind that really wants to know the answer to the questions you verbalize, and follow it up with some ACTION.
Any candidate who lists an accomplishment or a quality as one of their selling points is opening that point up for public examination.
To that end, it is fair to understand Bonoff’s role in legislation she touts and her business experience.
And it is fair to understand how instrumental Madia was in working with the UN to strengthen Iraq’s justice system. Did he lead or support the effort? And I’m a beleiver that if you list being the Student Body President as a qualification, then what you did as that Student Body President is eligible for public review.
DtM,
I don’t think anyone from the Madia camp has asserted that his record isn’t subject to public inspection. Again, any exposure I’ve had to the campaign they’ve been incredibly forthright in providing information.
The problem people have here is those who accuse Madia of lying simply because he hasn’t taken the exhaustive action of methodically releasing evidence to support every word out of his mouth. No candidate does that, and no candidate can be expected to do that. And, it’s particularly slanted when those same individuals refuse to apply the same standard to all of the candidates in the race.
We agree.
DantheMan is absolutely right. If you are willing to list your accomplishments you better be willing to prove them. Thats all part of proving your worth and integrity. I want to see it! I shouldn’t have to be the one trying to search for this information, he should have it available for the asking.
When you tout something in politics you have to be ready to prove it. All of you Jigar lovers need to ask yourselves if he is telling the truth he should be able to prove it. For me and many of my colleagues it is simple, prove to me who you claim to be beyond your speeches!
I want to see documentation that he in fact led the charge to defend the so called first ever “don’t ask don’t tell” case. I want to see proof that he in fact played an instrumental role in the setting up the judicial system in Iraq.
SHOW ME THE PROOF…otherwise it’s campaign BS!
And is anyone asking for proof that Terri Bonoff has executive business experiences, and made valuable and measurable contributions to the companies she worked for?
RM went and looked for it himself because he didn’t demand that the candidate provide the proof of her stated experience.
Yes, Union Man is a barker with no bite. He wants everyone else to do the homework and serve it to him on a platter.
Well maybe we want proof of identity too. Show us your union badge, with your number and proof of membership.
UM - “DantheMan is absolutely right. If you are willing to list your
accomplishments you better be willing to prove them.”
Read his post again, UM/WFER. He said it was up for “public review”. If you have such a tenuous grasp of the facts, how credible are u or the Bonoff campaign.
Others have posted links as to how you can obtain an FIA request from the Marines. Have u tried it out. Or will the Bonoff campaign not reimburse u for that ?
When I say up for public review, I mean the questions can be asked. RM has asked questions about Bonoff’s business experience. UM has asked questions about Madia’s specific role in “setting up the Iraq justice system”.
Then the candidates have every right to give you a satisfactory answer or not.
Based on the answer, you have every right to support that candidate or no support them.
I personally think that the DFL was light on all three candidates — they could have asked all three to do alot more proving of claims and experience. Just my two cents.
Well as a hard line DFL’r I refuse to believe him. Sure send me to an internet lead that you know will take me forever to get the proof. I’m not the candidate that needs to prove myself, Jigar is.
Am I wrong in asking for proof? I don’t think I am. As a candidate he should be, or his surrogates on this blog should be, ready to prove his worth and justify his claims.
I WANT THE TRUTH, AND I CAN HANDLE IT!
UM -
No, you are not wrong in asking for proof. In fact, I admire that you want to know more about your potential congressman than a one-liner in a stump speech.
That goes for all candidates for all offices.
“SHOW ME THE PROOF…otherwise it’s campaign BS!”
Again, the mere fact that Madia isn’t on this board responding to your demand for proof — a demand he’s neither refused to provide to my knowledge or that it appears you’ve ever actually asked him to do beyond here does not make it “campaign BS.”
You once again conveniently ignore your double standard, just as you’ve ignored your double identity. Where are your complaints that Bonoff has not fully detailed all of her campaign claims?
As for documentation being available “for the asking.” first, you have to actually ask first. Second, I’m sure his campaign office does not have various military documentation laying about ready to prove everything he did while a Marine. No different than I’m sure Bonoff would claim that her dealings on the transportation bill behind closed doors must, in fact, be kept behind closed doors — a good deal of Madia’s work, I’m sure, is reasonably classified or at least not at his discretion to divulge.
Well maybe we want proof of identity too. Show us your union badge, with your number and proof of membership.
For your information Virtually Speakinig, there is no such thing as a union badge. I have proof of membership every month that I pay dues.
I am a true union man, and when I see the proof that justifies Jigar’s claims I will be more than happy to disclose my information!
November 4, 1996
Dole would bring integrity, leadership to highest office
By By Jigar
Bob Dole has always been a soldier, from his trying World War II days to his dedicated years on Capitol Hill. This old soldier has come back for a battle on behalf of his country, and is deserving of the opportunity to do what he does best — serve the United States. Dole is the man who will fight on behalf of our generation, our communities and our nation.
By 2013, Social Security will be broke, in desperate need of money to pay debts. This will be the same period in which our generation will be firmly entrenched in the work force. Income taxes will need to be raised or government spending will need to be slashed in a draconian manner in order for the United States to remain financially solvent. The effect on our generation will be devastating. Currently, Medicare is growing at a rate of 11 percent a year, and will surpass Social Security in the year 2000 as the largest government program. That will have back-breaking consequences for our generation. The time has come for our generation to unite, cast aside our political affiliations and vote on behalf of the interests of our generation.
The obvious question now arises — which candidate better represents the interests of our generation? Ironically, the man who is 50 years older than most college students, Bob Dole, will serve our generation’s interests far better than the incumbent. President Clinton demonstrated his callous position toward our generation in May 1995 when Congress proposed, as a bold measure on behalf of our generation, to slow the growth rate of Medicare by 4 percent. Clinton, recognizing the political volatility and opportunity for political exploitation involved in addressing so touchy an issue, resorted to demagoguery, scared the elderly and forced Congress to withdraw the proposal. Clinton knows better than anyone else that entitlements need reform, yet when the time came for a strong stance, he chose to play politics rather than take a stand on behalf of our generation. Clearly, Clinton does not represent our generation’s interests.
Dole supports reform, and will be forced, regardless of his position, to reform entitlements, which will support our generation. The reason is simple — if Dole is elected, it will be primarily on the basis of his proposed 15 percent tax cut, and consequently this cut must be priority number one for Dole. This cut cannot be made without entitlement reform. Entitlement reform is inevitable under a Dole administration — excellent for our generation.
Although Dole is better for our generation, the president must also be better for our communities. Our communities are plagued with crime, evidenced by urban decay as well as societal breakdown. Dole has a two-planked position regarding crime — prevention and enforcement.
Primarily, Dole advocates a policy of prevention, stressing educational reform as the major means to keep youngsters out of trouble. Real educational reform is only possible with political courage, for the single biggest impediment to educational reform in this nation is a political powerhouse, the National Education Association. The NEA is a powerful teachers union known for opposing such reforms as performance-based pay as well as state and national testing standards. Jaime Escalante, the award-winning Calculus teacher whose story inspired the movie “Stand and Deliver,” said, “Unions are more interested in politics than kids.” President Clinton’s hands are tied on this issue, as the Democratic National Committee has accepted more than $3.5 million from the NEA since 1993. In fact, Clinton, under pressure from the NEA, actually reversed positions on a reform bill that would have allowed poor children in the District of Columbia to receive grants to attend better schools.
Despite the dilapidated state of education, the NEA and Clinton continue to preserve the status quo. Dole has stated numerous times that he will take on the NEA, advancing the cause of education in our communities, as well as reinforcing the message that, at the presidential level, the good of communities and the nation should not come before political gain.
The second plank in Dole’s position revolves around law enforcement. Dole has proposed a revitalized war on drugs, complete with a task force linking the defense department, CIA and Drug Enforcement Agency to beef up the interdiction of illegal drug shipments in the United States. Clinton’s record on drugs is clear and disturbing. He slashed the drug czar’s office by 50 percent; not surprisingly, drug use among teens doubled during his term. The task of real leadership on the part of Clinton in the war on drugs stands in sharp contrast to Dole’s strong commitment to our communities.
Finally, after addressing concerns regarding our generation as well as our communities, it is time to address an issue facing our nation as a whole: presidential character. The presidency of the Unites States is the highest office in the world, different from all other U.S. positions in that the president serves as a national figurehead, a spokesman for the entire country. Therefore, fairly or unfairly, the president is responsible for upholding the dignity and respect of the office. Dole, who served so valiantly in World War II, who rose above tremendous odds to conquer his debilitating injury, who devoted his entire life to national service, is a man of whom the entire nation can be proud. The nation can look to him for leadership and guidance, without fear of being dragged down by weekly scandals. Bob Dole will restore honor to the office of president.
Dole is a man committed to the betterment of our generation, our communities and our nation. He has stood tall on behalf of his country his entire life, never compromising his integrity or the nation’s well-being for political gain. If given the honor of serving his nation one last time, Dole will continue to do what he has done his entire life — make us proud.
Jigar Madia, a sophomore studyingbiology and business, is Minnesota Student Association Speaker of the Forum.
Some Democrat! Sounds like good ol Norm Coleman, but the other way around. Should we ask Ash Madia which way the wind is blowing?
Union Man,
Have you called his office and asked for a copy of his DD214? Have you asked for a vitae that shows what cases he worked on while in the military and at RKMC?
If not, then stop demanding them here and stop acting like anyone is hiding anything from you. If you have called and requested this information, and been denied, then post that.
Also, while demanding. Please call Terri Bonoff’s campaign and ask why her personal assessment of her business background varies dramatically from her ex-husband’s? Also, please ask specifically what she did to personally solve the transportation impasse as she has claimed loudly and publicly.
Let’s quantify all of the claims. I’m sure J. Ashwin Madia or Jigar Ashwin Madia will be as forthcoming as Terri Paulsen Bonoff.
The difference between Bonoff’s and Jigar’s claims is that Jigar says that these are qualifications that show his reasoning as a better candidate. All I’m asking for is legitimate proof that these claims actually took place.
If I can’t be provided with the proof, I guess that Terri Bonoff can claim that she was the pivotal reason behind the success of Microsoft. Because she wouldn’t be able to prove it, would we believe her? NO!
The fact is that Jigar claims these accomplishments, but has yet to retract his positions on issues and positions he has taken in the past that there is substantial proof of. I’ve yet to hear any of his surrogates on this blog explain or say that Jigar has retracted his positions in those articles he wrote. The only thing I hear is that they were 12 years ago, let him slide. He was an eighteen year old kid, give him a break……NO I WON’T, ANY MANY OTHER TRUE DEMS WILL NOT GIVE HIM A PASS ON THIS!
I’m really saddened, Michael, that you take direct marching orders from the Bonoff campaign without bothering to read. If you had, you’d look through this blog and find these old writings of Ash’s back when he was 18 have already been rehashed multiple times.
So, you want a litmus test for being a Democrat? Exactly how long must one conform to your way of thinking before they become “acceptable” to you as a Democrat? Do you have a “pre=existing” thought issue or can people never change their mind in your world?
I’m a member of the Democratic party that welcomes all, doesn’t damn people for changing their minds, and does encourage people to grow in their opinions. What party is it that you belong to?
Is it really any shock why Terri Bonoff is struggling so mightily in this campaign when her supporters really can’t come up with anything more than “his bio is too good to be true” and cutting and pasting the same entire decade old article over and over again?
So Sorry, I won’t be fooled fool.
Sorry, I want substance. If you claim it you’ve better be ready to prove it otherwise it’s either a lie or you have stretched the truth! In politics you MUST be ready to substantiate your claims. It’s all about proving your integrity as a person.
I’m of the type, and many other true Democrats are, that don’t just hand someone respect and belief. You must prove your worth. It’s something you earn, not handed to you.
Don’t be fooled but do your own research if you want (demand) answers. Don’t come on a blog and demand them here. Pick up the phone and ask. No one is hiding anything but you, Union Man, are the one making false claims. You falsely claim that J. Ashwin Madia, is hiding information when you haven’t asked for it.
We’re over you and your self righteous demands. Until you prove that you have actually raised a finger to find the information you demand so sanctimoniously, you don’t deserve an answer from anyone here.
Frankly, I’m glad he hasn’t repudiated his opinion on student fees at the UofM. The current student body president (a Dem) also is decrying them, too. They are excessive and out of order….not a Dem or GOP position, frankly. Hmmmm…..I liked Bob Dole, too. Does that disqualify me from the Dem party, too? Does it disqualify others who are now elected directors in the different senate districts who actually voted for Reagan? Exactly how long do you have to belong to your Dem party in order to be a “dem” and run for office? Where is this quantified? How can we all find out the rules for your party? My Dem party isn’t like that. Mine is open and accepting and welcomes new people.
“he difference between Bonoff’s and Jigar’s claims is that Jigar says that these are qualifications that show his reasoning as a better candidate.”
You are kidding me right?
- Terri Bonoff isn’t claiming executive experience as a qualification?
- She isn’t claiming her role in the transportation bill a qualification?
- Her battles with outsourced bus drivers?
- Her bipartisanship abilities in the legislature?
- Her role Hopkins Legislative Action Coalition?
- Her conflict negotiation as part of her baseball league?
I’m not saying all of these aren’t qualifications. I’m just saying if you’re going to take such a ridiculous stance against Madia, at least be consistent and demand that Bonoff provide the same documentation. Actually, at least demand that SOMEONE provide the information by taking the time to ask the campaign to provide it for you.
I also want to make it clear, I’m new to this blog. I’m not a surrogate for Bonoff or someone else that had posted in the past. I’m a true Democrat that is more than willing to allow others to join our party regardless of what you thought in the past. I just need proof that you indeed are what you claim to be Jigar.
I accept that someone could’ve seen the light regarding some of the issues that Jigar claims. But I want a test drive first. Just because he worked on a few campaigns these last two years is not enough. He has caused some wounds that have yet to heal by taking the positions he had in the past. Jigar has had 12 years to repudiate his positions, and has yet to do so. I have a problem with that. I would like to see him in a public statement say that he no longer takes those positions against NEA and ones fundamental right to join a union.
Until he shows legitimate proof of his claims and repudiates his former positions publicly, I can not and will not support him as a candidate.
Union Man,
Have you called his campaign and asked for what you want? We’re all volunteers and most of us are newbies to this blog, too. No one is asking for blind acceptance. Just hold both candidates to the same level of blue skies. If you have a specific issue with him, call and ask. You’ll probably be surprised. I’m not so sure that you’d get the same treatment over at Terri’s. Unfortunately for her, she put out her spin on her past and her ex-husband put out a totally different story. Those two have yet to be reconciled, too.
WDM - my guess as volunteers you should have access to his camp. If I were you, I would want everyone to see the proof. There are other people that are reading this blog that don’t post. My guess it would be better that you post the evidence for everyone to see.
The problem is that as you can see with me, as soon as I posted questioning Jigar I was attacked. Other people have questions but will not post because they don’t want to be attacked.
Please reach out to his campaign, get the information and post please.
UM,
First, I’m not sure a “volunteer” has any more access to the campaign than you do. The reason no one here is jumping up and down to help you is because you’ve shown no real indication that you really do want the information. If you really cared to know, you’d pick up a phone, dial 10 lowly numbers, and ask the campaign yourself.
Your posts, instead, have been nothing more than a masked drive-by attack on issue after issue. When your concerns are addressed on one issue, you switch to the next trying to claim a negative inference based on your own unwillingness to get your own questions asked or because someone won’t go out and get it for you. Then, in a show of your true motivation, you refuse to apply that inference to the Bonoff campaign who has provided no more information detailing her past experience than the Madia camp. You can’t expect a campaign to provide all information to all people — especially when those who really want to know that information aren’t willing to ask.
Here, if you want the information, I’ll do almost all of the work for you:
For general inquiries please contact us at
info@madiaforcongress.com,
763.544.3813
or stop by our office at
7224 Forestview Ln N. in Maple Grove.
If you really want the facts, call.
Thanks, Plymouth Dem. I’m a “volunteer” like most people here - as opposed to staff. I’d agree with your comments, too. If Union Man wants to debate positions with the Madia campaign, he should call them. I’d also ask that he apply the same litmus test to the Bonoff campaign and hold them to the sand standards in proving her claims.
Again, I’m not the candidate here Jigar is. If he wants votes he should prove his willingness to answer hard questions. My guess is that some of you are far more then volunteers.
If you want my vote and others Jigar campaign, prove your worthiness of the vote and answer my questions. Don’t make excuses that I haven’t asked, I’m asking again! Post your response for everyone to see, not just me. I’m not the only one that would like to see the responses!
Now, more importantly why is it many of you haven’t asked the same questions I have. I’ve looked back on this blog and have yet to see a retraction of the union positions Jigar had in the past. Why is that, has he not changed his positions?
Union Man, again, you need to ask these questions since they are of interest to you. I have asked ones that matter to me of Ash and received answers that satisfied me. My issues are veterans issues as I am a veteran myself. My only attachment to the campaign is having sat on the DFL Veterans Caucus endorsing committee that screened questionnaires by all three candidates. These issues had to do with issues relating to veterans, military retirees and their families. These are issues that matter to me. I have also discussed gay rights and women’s rights with Ash and his answers satisfied me, too.
If you have specific questions, I suggest you follow up with them like I have - with him personally.
I’m not out to win your vote. That’s the candidate’s responsibility. I am just another voter, frankly. The only campaign I have actively volunteered for - even wearing a t-shirt for - has been Al Franken’s. I’m a long time resident of the 3rd and SD42 and as such have done my homework for the candidates on issues that matter very much to me. It is your responsibility as a voter to do the same for yourself.
Union Man -
I agree with the posters, these questions can be answered directly by his campaign.
Anyone reading these threads will see I haven’t bought in to the Madia bandwagon, but it is more due to his lack of local track record than anything else. It is just absent. No call to his campaign office is going to magically create years of service in the 3rd CD that don’t exist.
Ciresi’s Counterpoint in the Strib today nailed it. You don’t need to be a lifelong public servant to earn higher office. But having tangible results and successes amongst the very people you are hoping to represent is sure important.
Madia is an impressive young man. I’ll be proud if he is a lifelong resident of and contributor to the 3rd CD. But to represent us in DC? Maybe someday. But I haven’t seen anough yet.
UM,
I’m not convinced you would ever vote for Madia — you clearly have a chip on your shoulder against him.
That said, you are either lazy or really don’t care about the answer to your question or both. For god sakes, paste one of your rants in an email and send it to the campaign.
I’ve had my questions satisfactorily answered (as have the vast majority of delegates who voted for him). I’m not going to ring up their office because you are too lazy to do so.
I don’t exactly hear a deafening call by the electorate for him to produce the meeting agenda he received when he discussed issues related to Iraqi reconstruction with other diplomats or the powerpoint he used when presenting issues related to the Iraqi legal system to U.S. Generals.
I also don’t hear anyone besides you accusing him of lying about his experience and I haven’t heard anyone coming out with evidence that he is stretching the truth. He’s been covered in the national military media. He came from a very small / tight legion on Marine JAG officers. I don’t think there are that many of them (several hundred?). Do you really think Ashwin is such an idiot as to claim things he didn’t do, knowing he would get national military media coverage, and that if he was no one would have yet to come out and point it out?
arealunionman@yahoo.com>
To: info@madiaforcongress.com
Sent: Friday, March 21, 2008 2:34:22 PM
Subject: Former positions
I have come across some disturbing information regarding Jigars position on a union organizing attempt and NEA. Can you tell me if he has ever made a public apology and retracted his position? If he has, I would like to see a copy of his retraction.
Lets see if there is a response……….
Union Man,
Still unable to use the phone to ask? Let us know when you have made the effort. It’s your issue. You should ask.
I would rather ask by email so I can post a response…..
Works for me. I live by email, too.
I am a relative first timer to politics, and a first time delegate to the state convention. I am wondering what makes people act like such jerks when candidates in the same party have such similar positions.
Seriously, candidates within the same party (especially the Dems - there are some crazy Republicans) all have similar platforms. Then by the end of the nominating process, they have all adopted what seems to be the most popular for the Dems in the area. At the local level and the national level. It seems only to be a question of who will be more effective. And even then you could say you are splitting hairs.
If we are talking about Congress here, we are basically talking about voting on bills, occasionally writing bills, and communicating with your community. So it just is a matter of who you prefer. PREFER to represent essentially the same agenda. It is a preference, not a hatred of one and a worshiping of another. That to me makes no sense.
Everyone here essentially believes similar things. In CD3 and nationally WILL DEMOCRATS EVERYWHERE PLEASE CHILL OUT. Same goals. Same ideals. Same principles. It is just person that you don’t know and a similar voting pattern.
As a first timer, is this worth my time? Do democratic beliefs mean anything? I am anxious to find out.
UM - I commend you for doing research and planning to share the findings with us, rather than just asking questions (like I often do).
We’ll be interested in your findings.
Although not directly in response to UM’s email, Madia’s campaign did address the MN Daily articles UM relies upon within an email that is now posted on MNCampaignReport: http://www.mncampaignreport.com/showDiary.do?diaryId=1211
Plymouth,
I’m sorry but that article contains nothing about retraction of his position regarding ones fundamental right to organize, or a retraction of his comment about NEA. I assume that without retraction he hasn’t changed his position.
Jigar says in his letter regarding a positive campaign:
“Unfortunately, however, some who do not support this effort persist in engaging in the kind of old, cheap, and petty politics based on personal attacks that has corroded our system for far too long.”
That is what is said by politicians when they don’t like what the message is. SHOOT THE MESSENGER. I know I’ve personally observed him slamming Bonoff on her votes. So to say that he is playing only positive is BS.
Call it mudslinging, call it petty, call it horse shit, I don’t care it is something he wrote and he needs to retract it or stand by it. He can’t ignore it because if he gets the endorsement or by chance wins the primary, there are unions members that will not vote for him or the Republican and stay out of the race. You may say that is not big deal, but I can assure you that without full support of the labor community he loses!
Union Man,
Just a point of reference. How many union members reside in the 3rd CD? Do you have any idea? I’m not being a smart aleck. I’m just asking. I’ve only known a few ALPA and MAPE members personally who reside in the 3rd.
One note - the UofM is weird in the union stuff still to this day. I have a son who TA’s there and when the grad students were asked to vote on organizing into a union, they voted it down. (This was last year.)
By the way…no response by the Jigar campaign to my email.
West Metro,
Call your hero and tell him to answer my email. I’ve posted my complete email for everyone to see. I know, some may come up with the excuse that I just emailed him today, but remember this is a hot race and campaigns are vying for Super Delegates.
Correction….obviously I’ve known NEA members, too. I just really don’t think I’ve known personally any other union members in the 3rd. I’m really wondering…..
Gosh union man, I honestly believe that it doesn’t matter what you are told or who you talk to, you will only support Bonoff.
Ashwin Madia put out his personal cell phone number again today. CALL HIM AND ASK HIM YOUR QUESTIONS!
612.250.3378
So MAN UP and either call him and ask him or move on to some real issues!!
As a member of a union household, I truly question your union affiliation. So what union do you belong to???!
Most union families that we associate with are smarter than to fall for a 12 year old letter written by an 18 year old college student.
And the unions we know vet carefully before they endorse candidates.
So I guess the unions that have endorsed Madia are not very smart….
My point exactly….you took the words right out of my mouth, they aren’t very smart. What major unions have endorsed anyway?
So far the Teamsters and UAW for two……
munchkinmom,
Did a little research on Jigar’s and Bonoff’s campaign websites
http://mnpublius.com/2008/02/breaking-madia-endorsed-by-teamsters-local-120/
http://www.madiaforcongress.com/uaw.pdf
http://www.terribonoff.com/newsroom/teamsters
http://www.terribonoff.com/newsroom/afscme-endorsement
DO THE MATH! Better yet, I’ll do it for you. Bonoff – 93,000 – Jigar 16,500
Maybe the unions with the 93,000 members weren’t fooled?
Don’t ask me how two different Teamster organizations endorse different candidates, I don’t know their structure. All I know is that the Teamster organization with the larger number went Bonoff’s way.
Union Man claims he is a staunch Union Man. But does not know the structure of the Teamsters and how they endorse candidates. UM are u really a Union Man, or just a paid troll for the Bonoff campaign.
We have seen so many paid ? trolls for the Bonoff campaign that it is hard to keep track anymore.
So if some of the unions “aren’t very smart” why would it be important that a candidate support all of them out of hand? Wouldn’t it be better to have a candidate that feels willing to criticize when they feel a particular union in a certain situation isn’t acting in the best interest of the state or district they represent?
Rm,
All unions work differently when it comes to endorsements. I know in the union I belong to, local chapters are not allowed to endorse someone other than the main lodge. In some unions the endorsements come from the national office, and in some unions they don’t endorse at all.
As I have said in previous posts, I am not UM or someone from the Bonoff campaign. I’m just a concerned Democrat that must be shown worthiness of my vote!
Kerosene,
I don’t know what the heck you are talking about. You don’t make any sense to me. If you mean that you are trying to justify Jigars former position on unions because the union was not acting properly, you are wrong. It is about someones fundamental right to organize into a labor union of their choice. THAT IS THE LAW!
I had the occasion to speak with a GOP insider about the D3 race on Thursday. They had no idea I was from the 3rd. It was a social setting and they revealed that the GOP much preferred to run against Madia than Bonoff.
The guy almost wet himself with glee as he told me that they saw Madia as the really vulnerable candidate because of his lack of experience, flip flopping positions and he laughed as he told me that Madia had only moved into the 3rd just two weeks before he started his campaign. “Two weeks!, Do you think that is going to fly in this district?!” he laughed. “They are playing right into our hand if they put up Madia. He cannot win in the 3rd. Bonoff on the other hand, would be tougher”.
Geez. What are these Madia people thinking?
What KH said was that unions may not always act in the best interests of the people or the state. That is very true.
Unions often fight for what is essentially non-competition, price fixing (of wages), and lack of economic freedom. When the unions prevail, the people who pay the price are consumers or, in this case, taxpayers.
Unions have the right to organize. Employers have the right to not hire their workers. And candidates have the right to criticize them.
“Geez. What are these Madia people thinking?”
What did all superdelegates and Bonoff people think when they wrote Madia off in November? That’s what GOP is thinking right now.
The GOP will not underestimate Madia. You would have to be a moron to not see how effective his campaign has been. Call the GOP whatever names you’d like, but they want to win elections too.
Madia may have little experience and virtually no track record to examine (other than the ‘U’ years which are evidently off-limits), but he knows how to play this game of politics. He will not be underestimated.
Everyone in GOP circles who I talk to says that they could easily lose this seat to whatever ‘D’ is on the ballot, and if they win it will be by 1-3 points. Nobody is blowing this one off.
Interesting, truthwatcher. I speak with GOP people all the time and your info is exactly the opposite of what I’m hearing. In fact, Madia is the one they fear could draw the middle and moderate GOP as well as the Dems. Too convenient that you just happen to wander by this thread to post this disinformation.
I’m also hearing some very compelling names coming up for 2010 in the GOP, in the event Paulsen loses. These are people who either wanted more time to make the decision, had family or professional commitments that wouldn’t be resolved in time for this campaign, or (in most cases) felt that 2008 was a bad year to gamble your political life if you were a Republican.
The 1st re-election is anything but gauranteed, history will show us. If Bonoff or Madia are the next Representative, they will not have the GOP’s version of Wendy Wilde running as a token candidate in ‘10.
DTM,
I’ve been hearing some of the same stuff. Quite a few in the GOP are not enamored of Paulsen and don’t think he’s strong as a GE candidate for the seat. They’re, frankly, worried. They’re less worried against Bonoff because she’s less of a credible candidate on what they feel are their strong suits (Iraq, homeland security, defense, patriotism). I’ve heard, too, that they already have the feelers out for a stronger candidate for 2010.
Just reporting what I heard. He was pretty credible.