That can be a problem, though, when you come across legislators who actually know what they’re doing. One such legislator is Larry Pogemiller, the Senate Majority Leader, who excoriated Finance Commissioner Tom Hanson yesterday.
Pogemiller had a simple argument: Spending shifts are not at all the same thing as budget cuts. Shifts, obviously, need to be paid back. They’re not true savings, they’re just procrastination. That’s why Minnesota law now requires the budget to be balanced over four years, not just two. Over four years, the Governor’s budget runs a deficit of $2.6 billion.
The Governor says that he can fix the budget without raising revenues, but the fact is that he can’t. He has only “balanced” the budget if you ignore billions of dollars in spending shifts and new borrowing, and pretend that we’ll never have to pay for them.
Speaker Margaret Anderson Kelliher also chimed in, saying the Governor’s budget was not ready for prime time. Watch that video after the break.
here’s is a good page regarding Pawlenty & budget
http://allianceminnesota.org/page/community/post/joe/Brl
Also…I encourage everyone to do this…it’s very easy!
http://maketaxesfair.org/
Phone# for Gov’s office: 651-296-3391
CALL!! and call and call…
I WILL PAY YOU ON TUESDAY,
FOR A HAMBURGER TODAY?
Doesn’t this sound like a former Texas governor
who did what he pleased,
used what he did as a selling point before it came due
then got out of Dodge before the door hit him o the ass?
How about reduced government at all levels?
Is it just me or does everyone on this board have to wait to have their posts moderated by the Zach Censor before it is displayed? Am just wondering? Its seems as though most of you have your posts displayed immediately while mine are selectively audited by the MNP crew for a day or two before they are displayed?
Maybe MNP thinks the bloggers here are too intellectually challenged to read and respond to my posts…so they audit them first for “approval”?
Just wondering. Its seem odd that a website that loves the Constitution would censor the ideas of “selected” persons in order to save the others from seeing such ideas? I made two posts, yesterday, one after another, in the same thread. One is still waiting for “moderation”, the other is posted. Wonder why?
MN’s budget cannot be balanced by cuts alone. If it could Pawlenty would have submitted a budget proposal that did just that. He knows it can’t be done, so he is trying the smoke and mirrors approach to push the problem off once again without really fixing anything.
Revenue must be increased. There are no ifs, ands or buts about it.
Sure don. We can reduce government. Just stop driving on roads, don’t expect public education for your kids and grandkids, and don’t come bitching here when your house burns down/you get robbed, and public services aren’t there to help you out.
Have fun with chaos.
Oh, thats priceless…really. So, the budget really is only made up of roads (6 billion in new funding) Public Education (fine, get rid of it all…I’ll go elsewhere) Fire and police (who collect more revenue from us then they spend)?
Thats it huh? Thats all the budget is comprised of? That was a very nice, stereotypical answer to a very specific issue. Maybe you would like to take another shot at it? LOL!
Don,
You think that all of your blessings in life were garnered purely through your own pluck and hard work, and none of your quality of life is based on having a strong and well developed society. You wanna live in a country where only the wealthy can afford to be educated? Watch the crime rate shoot up, and your quality of life go down. Your quality life of, Don, is partially based on your good choices and hard work, but your quality of life is also benefitted by having a strong society that cares about things like education for all, caring for the less fortunate, and so on.
You people will never be happy until Minnesota turns into Mississippi where they spend nothing and have horrible education and quality of life indicators, but their taxes are low. You are seriously the most self-centered, short sighted, miss the forest for the trees lot I have ever seen
Don Huizenga,
“A paranoid is someone who knows a little of what’s going on.” ~William S. Burroughs
Nitro…I am sure that someone who is DAILY and DIRECTLY involved in local and state politics, knows little compared to a person like you…who does what?
Thought so…
Michelle Bachmann is daily and directly involved in local, state, and national politics. She knows tons. Granted most of it is wrong, made up, or lies, but yeppers, good argument Donnie. The world is full of people like you, who base their decisions on ideology and politics, rather than facts and evidence. Just because you immerse yourself in pig slop on the local and state level every day does not make you an expert, especially when you are ideologically petrified to a position.
Don Huizenga,
“
Nitro…I am sure that someone who is DAILY and DIRECTLY involved in local and state politics, knows little compared to a person like you…who does what?
Thought so…”
Yes, invoke a question then assume what my answer would be, what a dickhead thing to say, Don.
You may assume I am a communist leftist socialist marxist fascist acornist obamaist, and I’ll let you do that because nothing would entertain me more.
Make a sign and wave it around. “Nitro is a communist leftist socialist marxist fascist acornist obamaist. I’ll even make it for you if you like, so you can parade around with it in public.
Great, and very representative of the dittoheaded Republican base, Job!!
Don,
You do like to ask and answer your own questions.
Your posts are censured? You ask:
“Maybe MNP thinks the bloggers here are too intellectually challenged to read and respond to my posts…so they audit them first for “approval”?
These folks don’t have a clue who I am so I doubt that they are taking my challenged intellect into consideration before they post your comments. Perhaps you should be looking at what you are saying and questioning whether it has any merit?
I am curious what you meant when you made this comment?
“Nitro…I am sure that someone who is DAILY and DIRECTLY involved in local and state politics, knows little compared to a person like you…who does what?”
Do you have some special knowledge or expertise that lends more gravitas to your opinions over those of Nitro, or anyone else for that matter?
This discussion centers on the Governors use of accounting shifts to balance the short term deficit without addressing long term debt.
You ask, “How about reduced government at all levels?”. It appears that most of the commentors here don’t support the idea of gutting government to balance the budget when the fundamental underlying problem is not that government is too large but that too much wealth has been shifted to too few and our tax policy is improving the lives of a few while decreasing the overall living standard of the vast majority.
How low should taxes be and how small should government be? Could you provide specific answers to those questions without attacking me for asking them?
“That was a very nice, stereotypical answer to a very specific issue. Maybe you would like to take another shot at it? LOL!”
I’m not interested in fighting with your straw man.
You are clearly not interested in the services the government provides. Go without them. You’re welcome to live in a cave or a tree.
Listen..you are right about that…I am NOT interested in the services the government provides. I would LOVE to go without them, because I am a self-sufficient person.
And, specifically, Don Huizinga, I am telling you to live in a cave or a tree because that’s exactly the kind of quality of life that will be experienced by the lowest strata of our society in your socially minimalist dream.
In short, I think your ilk is a bunch of selfish pricks….not to mince words. I look forward to your next foray into electoral endeavors. I need somewhere to send my money. You and your “conservative” brethren are a menace to society.
Lojagoffmo…
Listen…I appreciate the comments…really. How would you determine if someone on the internet was “selfish”? Is there a criteria you use? A formula? Mind reading? What could I do to prove to you that I am NOT a selfish prick?
Don Huizenga,
“What could I do to prove to you that I am NOT a selfish prick?’
“Lojagoffmo…”
Both in the same comment.
That’s pretty sweet!
Great Job!
Alec, are all of my blessing derived from my own hard work? Of course they are. Given as a percentage? At least 85%. I have a basic, C average high school education. It wasn’t anything special. I went to college on student loans, and paid them all back. My parents are divorced and FAR from wealthy. Yet, I have started 3 companies on my own and have a pretty good standard of living. So, your assumptions are false.
Mississippi is the anit-MN…and if you want to compare extremes to make your point, have at it. BUT…in the end, let me ask you this. IS my quality of life in MN REALLY any better than in AK, NV, WA, IL, ID, TN, WV, FL, etc? Quality of life is relative. For instance, I dont hunt, and I rarely fish. I dont use public parks because they are boring. I dont call the police for anything and I can get in and out of town without driving on a single plowed road. So, WHY is my quality of life better here in MN than say in the Caymans?
Additionally, your stereotypical assumption that Republicans dont care for the downtrodden is as disgusting an insult as they get. I do more for charity every year than most people do in their lifetime. The difference is that I want to see churches and private citizens give to charitable causes…not just hand money over to the government, to be dispersed to whatever group they think most needy of it. My way allows for direct interaction and visualization of results. Giving money to the government to give to other people loses its personal touch…its societal understanding and “face placing” of the needy. Charity should be between people….NOT interceded and dispersed by some government entity.
I appreciate America, our standard of living, and our way of life. BUT…even YOU have to admit that the recent actions of this administration are opposed to the basic founding principles and tenets of a representative republic. In other words, I want my children to have the SAME opportunity for SELF advancement and success for themselves, in America, that I had, and that my parents had, so on and so forth. You?
Nitro…honestly, I have no idea what you just said. How old are you? Complete sentences are a must in a public forum…so please…quit embarrassing yourself.
I appreciate the insults though! Thanks!
Here’s what I said.
After asked me a question and answered the question for me like a pompous ass, I commented:
“Yes, invoke a question then assume what my answer would be, what a dickhead thing to say, Don.
You may assume I am a communist leftist socialist marxist fascist acornist obamaist, and I’ll let you do that because nothing would entertain me more.
Make a sign and wave it around. “Nitro is a communist leftist socialist marxist fascist acornist obamaist. I’ll even make it for you if you like, so you can parade around with it in public.
Great, and very representative of the dittoheaded Republican base, Job!!”
What don’t you understand?
Second try? Third try is the charm.
Ron…censoring my posts is rather insulting, and it does nothing to further the ideas of free speech, etc. So, no other comment is necessary outside of saying that the site owners like to decide what they want to allow and why….and I often have to question those practices.
Yes, I would say that my involvement in local politics gives me a leg up in the value of our two positions as Nitro gets his info from the general media without really knowing whats happening inside the House Chamber. I would question Nitro’s overall political knowledge down to the basic foundations of how our legislature even works. I dont think he really knows anything other than what he reads or watches on TV.
If what you said about wealth shifts were true, than the deficits should not be what they are because the higher wealth shifted to the upper 10% should reflect increased revenues into government coffers as those taxpayers are at HIGHER marginal rates than the other 90%. In other words. If you gave a higher portion of the GDP pool, and the wealth pool, to the top 10% of earners, then the revenue to the treasury should increase as more of their wealth would be dispersed into the coffers due to higher rates and fewer deductions, etc. But, if you make less than 120,000 per year, you would have no idea what I am talking about.
Government has grown PAST, or at a higher RATE than GDP, inflation, and all OTHER economic indicators. That is a fact. There are NO real advances in the services the government provides, yet the state continually runs deficits because of the SPENDING. To say that the government is NOT large display utter ignorance of the facts. Go back and look….compare STATE services, education QUALITY, and general state “quality of life” services just ONE decade ago…and look at what THAT cost. Now, fast forward to today…compare the SAME items…and the costs. Now, tell me…how can we have the SAME programs, the SAME crappy education, the SAME street plows, the SAME MN Care program, the SAME police and fire protection…yet spend almost double what we did 10 years ago? Did YOUR income double since 1999?
Its labor. The same reason Chrysler went bankrupt, the same reason GM will follow. Union labor…generational debt, etc, etc, etc.
Now, what do we do? AUDIT, CHOOSE VALUABLE PROGRAMS, REDUCE EMPLOYEE NUMBERS, OFFER EARLY RETIREMENT, INCREASE EFFICIENCY AT ALL LEVELS, TAX INCOMING DOLLARS VIA CASINO’S and TOURISM, and REDUCE STATE MANDATES AT ALMOST ALL LEVELS to REASONABLE LEVELS.
This is a debate I would be glad to have with you…but its hard to define an entire position, or plan, on the internet. Maybe some other time? Maybe a Rep vs Dem MNP debate…or roundtable?
BTW…be sure to come to the tax cut rally!
Don Huizenga,
If people like you are representatives of the people of Minnesota, that is very sad. Your ego, and obvious outrage driven rhetoric, is a perfect example of why the Republican party is so unpopular.
That has nothing to do with my beliefs. That has everything to do with the TYPE OF PERSON you are, JUDGING FROM YOUR COMMENTS HERE.
GREAT JOB!!!
Why? Because I am right and you have no plausible responses?
Nitro…look at your posts. You have a difficult time putting complete sentences together. And you dare to criticize me? LOL! Listen, I really dont care what you think…and I have little tolerance for people who do nothing but make ridiculous comments on the internet…while never reaching out and doing something useful for the community or your party.
You can think whatever you want of me…thats fine. And, I also really dont care what you think about a party you would never vote for anyway. Got it?
Don Huizenga,
“I have little tolerance for people who do nothing but make ridiculous comments on the internet…while never reaching out and doing something useful for the community or your party.”
Are you assuming that I don’t?
Don
If you are indeed being censored, and by the bulk of your comments that seems unlikely, it is perhaps necessitated by the fact that you often don’t say anything that contributes substantially to useful dialogue.
If you truly are a believer in small government, why would you want to be a part of this big one? That smacks of the same thinking as Michelle Bachmann, a carreer government worker and politician, who constantly wants to downsize everything about the government but her paycheck and benefits.
Regarding the shift of wealth in this country and the tax burden on the super wealthy, since you are well connected you should bring that up with Warren Buffet. He does make more that $120,000 per year and he understands the problem. My income is more than adequate and I pay a lot of taxes, willingly. I know what I get for it.
You made this statement Don:
“To say that the government is NOT large display utter ignorance of the facts. Go back and look….compare STATE services, education QUALITY, and general state “quality of life” services just ONE decade ago…and look at what THAT cost. Now, fast forward to today…compare the SAME items…and the costs. Now, tell me…how can we have the SAME programs, the SAME crappy education, the SAME street plows, the SAME MN Care program, the SAME police and fire protection…yet spend almost double what we did 10 years ago? Did YOUR income double since 1999?”
I would agree Don. Life was better 10 years ago. I will leave it to you to figure out what happened in the intervening years.
Then you said this Don:
“This is a debate I would be glad to have with you…but its hard to define an entire position, or plan, on the internet. Maybe some other time? Maybe a Rep vs Dem MNP debate…or roundtable?
BTW…be sure to come to the tax cut rally!”
First, the ideas you proposed have already failed. Whats to debate? Second, you throw in an invitation to your tax cut rally. This is why people call you names and ridicule you. It is one thing to be ignorant but is really infuriating when you are both ignorant and smug.
You offered to pay me before for the advice but that is not necessary. I am a Democrat Don, we sometimes do things just because they are the right things to do.
You said to Alec:
“I appreciate America, our standard of living, and our way of life. BUT…even YOU have to admit that the recent actions of this administration are opposed to the basic founding principles and tenets of a representative republic. In other words, I want my children to have the SAME opportunity for SELF advancement and success for themselves, in America, that I had, and that my parents had, so on and so forth. You?
I don’t know your age but I am guessing that your parents lived through the last depression. Following that, we had estate taxes, antitrust and monopoly laws, progressive tax rates, and an active belief in social justice that provided educational opportunities, guaranteed home and education loans, social support systems and a general belief that a strong middle class was necessary to provide social stability and opportunity for all. That changed with Ronald Reagan. Reagan was much like Bush; patriotic but uninformed in many ways. He was a dupe of the Free Market ideologues that are primarily responsible for the economic turmoil we have today. Throw in the Neocons, who share your John Wayne view of American Hegemony and the religious right, who made a faustian deal with Big Money and the neocons in exchange for what they expected to be a utopian evangelical theocracy and that brings us up to November 2008.
We are waking up now Don. The nightmare is over. You don’t like camping or fishing but that might be better for you than going to that tax cut rally. You say you don’t like public parks because they are boring. What does that say about you Don if you are bored being with yourself? I know the allure of group think is powerful but you could use a little time by yourself to engage in introspection, as painful as it might be. Fishing is great for that. If you are a self made man, you still have some work to do.
Ditto… just with a much worse attitude towards moron Republicans who spout off bullshit like a fountain. About that socialistic failure rate of countries… so like Norway, Sweden and Canada are such socialistic hell-holes they all have a higher standard of living than we do as well as a lower birth mortality rate? What measurement are you using… lost tax dollars in useless wars? lost lives in useless wars? how many Republicans can dance on a pinhead politician?
4 posts in a row, Don? I guess we touched a nerve.
Oh, and everybody, Don doesn’t yell. His massive use of caps in that near-end paragraph above is just emphasis.
Yes, the caps are for emphasis only. Someone asked for specifics on budgets, I gave them some.
Thanks!
Ron, really…I am probably half your age, twice as successful and easily more smug. LOL! I can take some pride in that. I appreciate your continued psychoanalysis, and I feel badly that I cannot reimburse your for your time.
My ideas have failed? This country was founded on republican free market, capitalistic ideals. To say they have recently failed would be more accurate, but to say that the system as a whole has failed is not correct. There has never been a success of a socialists society. That we do know.
I do many other things in my spare time. Mostly volunteer work…so hanging out in a park, or fishing, is not my cup of tea as it is non-productive kinetics. You like it? Fine. I wont razz you about it. I expect the same in return.
Don Huizenga,
I have success, health, a loving family, and a steady job, and I know you may find it hard to believe, but I am a Liberal.
So, who the f*** do you think you are judging others here?
“The truest characters of ignorance are vanity, and pride and arrogance.”~Samuel Butler
Don Huizenga — As one of a few right wing zealots who participate here (that are a danger to our country, by the way, according to SHS), I completely agree with your analysis. We know that socialism has not or will not work by looking at history. I commend you on your determination to reason with those who can’t be reasoned with (in my opinion) on this site. We need more conservatives to make their voices heard here. It was also great to see you at the 2009 Tax Rally yesterday at the capitol. I thank you for your contribution to the event. Sometimes I try to picture the individuals that write here. Now I can put a face to your name.
Since when do Republicans own the term “capitalism”?
Seems to me we all own it. We all live it. We all embrace it in America. It is what I participate in every day, gladly.
Your Republican legislated narrow definition of capitalism, laissez-faire capitalism, has failed.
If you fail to recognize that, then wonder why the Republican party is completely in shambles, then your ignorance is going to assure a Democratic majority for a long, long time.
You can pin a mischaracterization of “socialism” on people you disagree with, that’s fine. You can call us fascist socialist marxist leftist acornist obamaists too. Your misleading name calling just makes you all look like out of touch buffoons, and that’s also fine with me. That’s why I say to you, C”Rush”, and your new master race buddy, “Great Job”.
Check those poll numbers for your reality check. Just what is it that makes Republicans so unpopular?
Look in the mirror when you ask that.
CMan, I’d like to hear your’s and Don’s explanation for why people admit to GOP affiliation to the tune of 21% nowadays, and independents lean right only at 16%. Are the rest of us unable to grasp the intricacies and nuances of GOP political philosophy? Is it just to complex for common folk to get?
Why did the democrats lose control of the congress at the time of The Contract for America? Could it be they over reached? Just like the republicans over reached and now have lost power to the democrats. Will the democrats over reach again. I’d say they have a hell of a good start! Power certainly is intoxicating, isn’t it y’all? You know, if both political parties could win back power, and then not try to punish the other side as their first priority, we may make some gains in this country. If the agenda that’s being pushed right now under the new administration is any indication of where we’re headed, be ready of the pendulum to start swinging back the other way. Here’s hoping. Hey, I’m for “hope and change” after all!
C”Rush”,
“the republicans over reached”
There is a reason the Democrats won.
Look in the mirror. People like you represent Republicans.
Great Job!
Don and CMan,
Get used to losing. It is the fate you both are embracing. The reason people here ridicule you is that you deserve it.
Don: “There has never been a success of a socialists society. That we do know.”
CMan: “We know that socialism has not or will not work by looking at history.”
Whether you state this identical idea forwards or backwards it is still a profoundly ignorant statement on many levels and I believe that both of you are oblivious to that. There is a reason why they call you dittoheads.